Emo Dojo™ Presents: John Emotions
Emo Dojo™ Presents: John Emotions

Episode · 9 months ago

Coming Out Crazy: Disclosing Our Hidden Differences

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

John talks with fellow podcaster, KT, about the positives and negatives of accepting labels and sharing your mental illness diagnoses with others.

It was up I'm johnny motions, and thisis the EMO Dojo podcast. Today's episode is entitled Coming Out Crazy,disclosing our hidden differences, so check it out. I was online and metanother podcast or named Kati, and we were talking back and forth and wantedto do a podcast together, but we weren't sure really what the topicshould be. So since her podcast connect with Katy Speld, with a K, connect andKaty as the letters Kat. So she has a podcast called connect with Katy, whichtalks about mental health issues also- and I propose that we talk about thepositives and negatives of quote- unquote coming out crazy and I was goingto cut it up into abunch of different episodes because we talked for like a hour and a half or so,but as I started to listen to it, aside from a couple points where we just kindof well, I took a break, take a bong rip and that sort of thing but desidefrom that. It's pretty cool interview intact. So I'm just going to let itplay as you can see when you downloaded this particular episode. It's extralong, that's just because I found the conversation engaging and did notreally want to edit much out so without further ado. This is myconversation with Katy from connect with Katy on coming out crazy,disclosing our hidden differences. Thas are all about for me. I don't I'mnot here, like I told you, I'm not here, to make a ton of money like this isjust a fun like making all these connections. Everyone having these cool,like you, said, organic conversations that you know sometimes don't reallyhave a purpose, but we're just here having fun, you know yeah! No! Itotally agree, and it goes kind of goes back to that. Do you let your feelings out when youget angry or do you keep them in and it's man and it's the same fucking waylike especially with the podcast, because sometimes I let my feelings out,and I mean to do that in that moment, right like I have no other outlet, Idon't go to confessional, there's, not a dog to talk to around here. There'snothing that so I just talkingto a mike well after that, whatever episode endswhatever kind of episode, it is, I'm not sure if it's hyperactivity or Hypermania or spectrumbullshit, I don't know because theyre they all blend together. But I knowwhen I'm in an episode- and I know whatever I'm doing some shit now- thatI have bad judgment and but you don't when you, even if youknow you have bad judgment in the moment, you don't really know whichdecisions are the bad ones. That's true, so yeah putting ut onepodcast and all this and then a week later, I'm like, I said all that out loud, I'm like I'm such a Fragie, littlebitch and like then, my current self hates my previous self and that's sounhealthy yeah, and sometimes I think my current self fears my future selftoo yeah. You know what I feel that that'scrazy, that you say that, because I feel the same way I think about,because I and I think it's a confidence thing to which I'm not you know, wereI'm going to just be all open about everything on this. On this particularepisode, but you know, like I, struggle with confidence still quite a bit. Youknow I struggle with, like being able to you know like wake up every morningand just be in this great, like happy mood, and you know just cheerful- andyou know want to be around everybody like I'm not like I'll have days whereI literally will just be angry and ill just I don't want to really do anything.I don't want to talk to anyone, you...

...know, and it's nobody's fault, you knowwhat I mean like it really isn't. Anybody's fall like it's really justit's me being angry at something and most of the time it's me being ary atmyself. H, that's the thing. Righ yeah, you mentioned fault, and I a long timeago, when I first started reading about mental disorders or disease or Wyouknow dysfunctions was the idea of blame and I'm like wow. We don't need toblame anybody. Nobody needs to blame anybody. So when H, it gets really hardwhen you're down on yourself to not blame yourself, but it's also like when Y, when yourstarting to feel that way angry at others, even though you don't blame them andyou but you're still angry people get defensive. I think like family members,if you're angry they'll, think you're angry at them and I'm like no, no I'mjust inrupting, I'm like I'm ix, I'm a volcano exploding on everything. I justhappened to be around you like I'm, not angry at you. I'm angry most t atmyself, exactly that's so frustrating because you you a kind of sense itwhile you're in the moment too, like you mentioned when you get up in the morning like andnot even just being happy but being functional at all, I wake up either ina state of panic like that falling feeling when you fall from a dream andthen wake up that feeling with me starts when I wake up. I wish I couldstay sleep because the moment gaine consciousness life starts. Rushing atme some days and I I just want to pull the covers over my head- say no go away.Yep and you just want to lay in bed all they lon iy yeah, like you, don't evencare. If you have any interaction, I ga only see how people become homelesslike truly except on homeless label, because it gets so easy to say fuckthis. It feels so I'm suffering so hard in my own mind that I just don't care.If I go to work, I don't care. If I get fired, I don't care if there's no gasin the car or internet or I don't care. If I heve you just you can't function,don't care about those things. I guess it's like. Maybe I've never had a heartattack but wh in the middle of a heart attack. Are you worried about payingthe rent? I DOUBT IT Andi? Don't people don't take od untilyeah? I don't think people take mental illnesses that seriously becausethey're they're invisible well a heart attack is invisible to, but don' knowit seems kind of fucked up that you can never quite convey how much you'resuffering and everybody's level of suffering and what they can Edor isdifferent, which makes it like, I said, even from fucking week to week. Myfuture self will be an asshole to my previous self. Definitely it's hard tocatrack. No, that that's something that I do all the time. I'm always and it's,and it's not even just you know about that, but it's like th the thoughtsthat I have like. I have the like racing thoughts, all the time that Ihave to dove this, and I find myself saying I need to do this all the timeor have to do this. I need to do this and I and then, when I really I'm moremindful, I try to be I'm not always going to be when I try to be my anclein those situations like I'm like. Why do I need to do this, or why do I haveto do that? You know I mean this is the kind of stuff that I struggle with andliterally almost a daily basis. It's just like that. It's like a it's almostlike an adhd thing. I've never been diagnosed with it, but sometimes Ireally just feel like I have hyperactivity like crazy yeah and that it take it's tough. Whenyour inner modologue uses those words I go fuck. I need to get this done. Ineed I don't know where that comes from. I have that too. Do I wait until things become a needbefore I start internalizing that talk with myself, because I don't now thatI'm thinking about it, I don't realize. I think I want something I want this. Iwant that that I don't my my inner Monlogu doesn't talk about want. It'salways need it's. This always suffeing fucking, this. It's a pressing needI'll fuck. I got an got to make a new...

...list of things to do. I got so manythings to do e. Why Yeah? It is it's a live! We're just trying to like a ratin a race in this capitalist society and the oftentimes I'm. You know Manticapitalist, we're just stuck in it so trying to play the game, but whenyou have a dysfunctioning mind, it makes it kind of fucked up you'veyearned for old days when they probably sat around in Togos on steps and eightgrapes and just pontificated about stuff. I'm like yeah, I was you know, probably succeed in those times yeah, but not see in yeah and Yo yeahyou're talking about like going this Se. That's what I N, I feel like that's aan kind of go in to like a spiritual thing. I don't know if you arespiritual at all Surean just going back and I feel, like we're kind of you knowlike old souls, people that talk like that, that feel like they belong inkind of like a different era like therethey would have just succeeded.You know, and just done such great things, because mental illness neverreally like people didn't know what it was that not different wasn't called anillness. You know right exactly Wat, I all disordered exactly and and that'sthe you know and kind of to bring that up to and like today. You know wepeople that are dysfunctional or have what we're talking about right now Imean there's so many different labels, for you know so many thoughts and actions and behaviors andoh you have this, because you do that and and it's become so common forpeople to just put a label on you that, and I think that that's what you knowhow we were going to talk about the pros and cons- and I think, like thebiggest like a Kan for me, is that I feel you know not with you,but I feel scared to even admit that. I think that I have several disorders.You know not just one and I'm in a in like. Why do I feel like? I shouldlabel myself with those, but I also feel like it's okay to come out and saythat you have things that you think would be considered a disorder for sureyeah o in the hindsight, having gone to doctors for twenty five thirty years,and that's not even counting the Times that I went as a child where I wentonce my parents didn't want to hear it, so they never took me back, but I put all the pieces togetherafterwards, but still there's like a good chunk of most of my life from thetime, I'm like five years old until him, twenty five thirty years old, where Ithought I was just fucking weird and like yeah, I was just trying to chaseall these substance abused things like I' totallya Canabas. I love wee right. Oh yeah me too defiite now, but I don't considerbe after all, the research and all the experience. This is one of the leastproblems I've ever had. There was a period in my life, though, wherealcohol was a problem. When I was a kid like a fourteen fifteen yearold, it wasanything I could ingest that did not involve a needle. If I could smoke itdrink, ITG or put it my mouth. I was doing it and I didn't know why, when I got oldenough and went to a doctor and started seeing therapist they're all like, ohthat's called self medicating, you were just trying to ease your own sufferingand I'm like Ohi get it. I get it and then it was a weird thing. It wasalmost like someone flashed the Magic Farry wand and I stopped using thosedrugs because I think oh no, it's whatever I'm, not suffering that bad tosuffer the fate of addiction. Right like I realized the risk so odd, yeah, no yeah tha, and that'swhat because I didn't. I wasn't really I didn't get into. Youknow drugs and alcohol until I was like eighteen, but I knew you know when Iwas like twelve years old. You know till I was like sixteen. Itstarted to really. I could really tell that something was kind of wrong withme and I tried to reach out in different ways to my parents, but Idon't think that they,...

I think that they were just trying tohide the fact that I thought that something was wrong if that makes anysense like they just tried to put me in sports and things to try to to distract me. You know what I'msaying like it wasn't, necessarily something that I wanted to do growingup and then, as soon as I was able- and I moved out like immediately when I wasseventeen right about to be eighteen- and I just went down that path of justdusalcoholism like just drinking every day, smoking you know anywhere fromcocaine. Just you know I did. I did lots of stuff, I didn't do you know. Ididn't do a lot of pills and stuff like that, but I tried stuff, you know and Iknew yeah. I got messed up all the time O to parties and just take whateverpeople yeahdin out for sure Yep exactly and not hanging out with good people. Imean getting myself in situations that I could have gotten in some realtrouble. You know what I mean right right. How many times did you not dielike? I can't even de tat time I said who did die and then sometimes thepeople had died in those situations like fuck. Why wasn't it me and whydidn't I learn I like I kept at it for like ten years he was like a fifteen t,tenty five SSuch, a mass yeah. So so there is something to be said about atleast being diagnosed, but like do you accept the label? So what I meant totouch on a second ago was that so, throughout my say, young adulthood. Igot diagnosed with all kinds of things and I'm like oh well, there's pills forthat. They all they're all like here's a pill for this, but some of the thingsth t there aren't pills and some of the things it's arguable that theirdisorders, they're just differences, and you shouldn't try to treat them atall. So I'm like well what the fuck they all have similar. What do you call that symptoms IV? Las E yeah or they jusplay,because if it's not a problem, that it's not a symptom, but I mean they alldisplay similar attributes. Let's say: Yeah, I'm like well Fuckit am Y, myjust distracted because hyper or is this manic episode that starting I'like what the Fuck O do. I have a personality disorder and I'm justmaking all this shit up and then I go like orilike what the Fua lave atlasing Becaus, it's not because it's but that's just yeah. I STU YEA thatsame thing like I'm, just I'm like. Oh my gosh. That's me like totally yeah,but at the end, at the end, I'm not at the end now, but I'm at the end of thisfucking experimentation with medication, that's for sure and wearing labels. I'mlike well fuck. Let's go to the core of everything. What am I trying to do andwhatd it really ade up, I'm just trying to regulate my emotions and the way Ifit into the world so whetther. You call that any of the disorders or brintdifferent brain disfunctions cool. It doesn't matter what other people callthem. It matters. How I think of them exactly and then I starte to realize,wait, I'm just still a fucking normal weirdo like teenager before I ever gotGi nose, I'm just older, and I know more now, whit's great, I guess that'sfun, because then you can make conscious decisions, but it stilldoesn't. It doesn't eliminate the problem like if there's chemicaldysfunctions and my synapes Ar misfiring that's still going on, buthive learned to not overreact to Thit, I guess is the best way to say it M. doyou? If you don't mind me asking like, do you take any perscribe medicationfor anything? No, the last ones I took were concerda for adhd okay, but that started to raise myblood pressure and they're like yeah. I heard of that and like because it'sbasically speed so like well I'd rather than not because they're like, but youcan take blood pressure pills like no. How about I take neither and just dealwith my spazziness and they're like well, you can do that. It's not reallyaffecting you. Is it and like well aside from the fact that fucking moveevery year and can't hold down a steady job and people think I'm weird? No, itdoesn't affect me at all. Oh my gosh man, so they're like okay, well, keepcoming to therapy and I was in a small...

...town and e therapist wis like here youcan go to our church group. Oh my Godyou fucking ct mi like that thatthat's wow, I'm like I'm, not a churchy person, the whole inrait. I do not tellher. This town was so small and had way more churches than liquor stores. Somelike thanks and I just left really dejected. Oh my gosh yeah. I couldn'tdo that either. I'm not I'm not not that I'm not hating that any religionever O. No, no! I V begain t's Ati more that Outo side than not for me. Yeah. Itried I was raised by Southern Baptist when I was a young kid went to vacationBible School. I think I won contest. You know naming all the books of theBible up till about you know seven or eight years old cool mm Yep. He just kind of like it was at churchcamp. However uing questioning things, it really opened my mind: here's thecool thing at church camp when I was about fourth grade a kid in my cabin snucking, some contraband he brought in Fucking Kiss cards likebaseball cards, but with kiss on them, and they had like Gean, Simmon,spitting blood and throwing fire out of his mouth and Peter Chris on the DrumSeid exploding. All this stuff, I'm like what the fuck are. These dude. Ididn't talk like that in fourth grade yet iblew my mind: a Hen when we got backfrom camp a couple days later. He turned me on to this album he hadhidden in his closet. It was like Satanic, Kiss Music and, like Whoa,fuck yeah. This is awesome to like half superheroes Half Rock Stars, and thatwas the end for me like we're going to the dark side, people, that's Hilarious, we're going to thedark side, people and it was over that' nw. It took me a while to extractmyself. It was a series of Sundays where I tried to coerce my mom to. Letme stay home with dad to quote unquote, Watch football or watch the treestoogesor whatever, but the moment she went to church with my sister, my dad wouldwatch football and I would go upstairs and fucking rock out to my kiss recordH. that's Hilarious! All Right! Let's take a quick break andlisten to a little deep cut from the dark side. Yeah see I'm from from a little small town in Michigan, so I'm not used to I mean I move out tothe city, because I like what I would consider, even you probably would belike you have no idea what a city, no, no, I'M NOT SNOBBY! That way, because Igrew up, I started in the suburbs, I'm just curious and I get kicked out ofplaces. So I just well fucking when to go explore. Tell me about where you grew up, so I grew up in well. You know whereMichigan is and like the middle. Well, do you know where Detroit or Flin isyeah, both o course? Okay, okay, so more closer in between flint andLancing, not fleton Detroit, but I, like I'm closer to Flint Detroit area.That's why I'm saying that. But before...

...like growing up, I was I lived inbetween Flintan lancing in between an area right there. It was a small townin Corana. You know not a lot of culture, but the only reason that I didexperience cultures because my mom my birth mom. She she lived near Detroitso like I'd, go in and see her every other weekend. You know so thatd be soI kind of got like you know, a mix of both both worlds for a little while andthen that's what encouraged me to when I g t when I got older to move closerto not necessarily flit but like grahm blank area, and then I started findingmyself. You know hanging out with people in the Troy and Ann Arbor and you know just exploring and notnecessarily moving around, because I was trying to figure my life out. Youknow, like I said, for yea I had I I had a daughter, you know what I meanand that's what I'm saying. That's just how my world was like just in and outof different kinds of things and going to college and taking forever to go tocollege, because I was had what I am you know, not afraid to say any moremental illness. You know illnesses I would say going to collegeand trying to focus and failing- and you know what I mean just l kinds, Ocrazy stuff. How do d? How do you differentiate those terms? Okay, so,for example, there's we say mental illness. We say mental disorder and wesay like brain dysfunction or I even say you know Ra differences, but go ahead. Yeah. I know honestly, Idon't you know. I don't even like to say theterm, because I there's actually a conversation that I was just havingwith someone about the label and the no label, because why do I have to haveany sort of label on me? I'm just a human. You know, and I justact we allact differently and we all have something different about us right. SoI just try to tell myself that, but I hate even like thinking of theword by polar or Adhd, or you know, whatever, like personality disorders,you know all think things like that. I don't anxiety, depression like. Whydoes it have to be that I don't know because society made it that way, but it doesn't. But I don't necessarilylike saying that it is a mental illness or that I brought that up because Someti wellhere's, what thedifferentiation, I think is, I think, if it's a illness it can be treated andcured and igess Youre San. It's a disorder Youe stuck with it, but then are somedisorders misclassified as disorders, because there's no negative out of it,but what society puts on it? asbergers in particular, that's one ofthe more popular ones that lots of people have, but is it a disorder atall OAS? It just wwe're different. You know, but moving back to by polar, for example, disorder.There's nothing that can quote unquote cure that. That's why it's so damagingwhen doctors say you have that same with borderline personality disorder,all of the personality disorders, there's no quote, unquote cure youcan't really ticke up a pill for it, but then backing up to depression oranxiety, definitely an illness. In this context, I guessbecause you can', take a pill for depression and if it's commondepression- and you work your way out using the pill, to help you and getsome therapy, you can then stop taking the vill and Youe not depressed,necessarily in' same with anxiety. You can take apill to reduce your anxiety at the moment. You have it so think, that's where it gets Modey, becausethose don't seem as digmatized the things that you can take a pill andcure right as much as the ones at thefurther down you go into the discussion. 's like well thoas. Those really that's why Istarted focusing on labeling my emotions labeling my feelings. Insteadof labeling the dysfunction because th...

...the disfunction gets changed like everyforty or fifty years, they come up with a new name for it anyway, like y athat's, not accurate, yeah, no right they and then they. Youknow they did all different kinds of tests and back in the day with peopledifferent doing different things to their brain, and you know, and then wecame up with medication, but I wanted to say you know touching on taking medication.You know for anxiety and depression and when you know my doctor and therapist werelike you know, you know we think wehave fi polar blah, blah blah, and we wantto give you this kind of medication, for your anger and this mynication foryour depression and Bah Blah Blah and I was taking. I can't even remembereverything that I took, but it was always a different symptom that I had so like. Let's say,for example, example, you know I was taking Zolaf or something I would have the side effects. Thatwould be not the worst side effects of themedication. Obviously, because you know people can have super bad reactions ofmedication, but I'm just saying that I would have other symptoms so where Iwould have to take other medication yeah. Yes, is't, that that's you knowso that it would keep up with the medication that I was taking and I'mlike, but I don't want to be on all this medication like this. Is You know,N in the therapy like that? It wasn't doing anything for me, because I justkept bringing up like emotions. You know things that I didn't really thinkwere getting me. I didn't feel better. You know what I mean. I just I just aLi to right there. If it's not working, it's not working. You have, to give, Imean, I'm not antimats for any. I'm looking through my notes here,simewhere in my notes on my laptop, I have a list of all the meds have takethere's about fifteen there. At least half of them are antipsychotics. One ofthem in particular, called LEMICTOL. Has a nasty side effect that I caughtthat nobody mentioned, which was menangitis yet see. That was one of mine. That wasone of the ones that is Sony oneed. Oh my gosh, and you got it yeah yeah. Wecouldn't figure out what was wrong with me. I had a fever. My neck was justkilling me anm, like. Why is my necker? I never have headaches so yeah. I had, I think it's viral managitis fromLumicto D. I don't don't quote me on the viral part, but it's some kind ofManagetis and you read the Black Label on Lemictole and sure enough LemotraJine, whatever you want to call it. It's the same: Med, yeah. That's a sideeffect that you can't have it's rare most of the people. They worry aboutthe rash on Lemicdel. I never got EAA, but I did get he the other one yeah. Ithink that was the one that she put me on, because I looked I actually becauseI always always always did research on the medication that I got when Istarted to you know when I started to have side effects because, likesomething is wrong, you know it's not just me like it's this medicine. Sothen, when I started doing research- and it was that Limickdole or whateverI know I was on that one and I remember looking it up- and it said the men Anjoytis Vironmen Anjoytus andI'm like no, I can't do this. I'm done. I don't care like. I can't take thismedication right, as I scary I it's not worth it to me and just knowing thatit's almost like it hurt my neck. Like I, I literally like it's. Like myfellow didn't change. I don't see hat differently, I'm not hungover what thefuck is wrong. With my neck yeah. That was, I found my list so check it out.Here's all the things I've tried for the various things they've accused me of I mean diagnosed me withright: abillify, ateracks, Selexa, Simbalta, depicote,affexer, lemic Toletuda, Lexipro Yeuranton, which is Gaba PentonSeraquell, that's the first thing they give most people and they lose theirmind, try lepto vy, Briad and SIPREXA.

Those are the Oll, the ones that hadnegative or no effect, and then I tried positive effect, concerta medicalcannabis, Ridlin and Zoloft. So what was the first thing? You said every top one abillify, and that was the one that you had thenight of the all the negative effects on that list. You said Yeah Y, AH and acandofate yeah canafus is definitely I don't take any prescribed medication right now,because the they just threw somebony at me that I was just like I'm going tojust ging to smoke weed, and I don't know how in the fuck my fiance dealswith me. I really don't not going to lie to you. Sometimes I'm just like howhow do you deal with this every day, yeah. Well, understanding people knowthat there is a good side and usually outweighs the bad and also you sound,really aware right, you're, aware of your condition, whereas so many peoplethat have mental health problems don't deal with them at all and e, just theyspew them out all over without any accountability. So you certainly soundlike your accountable to your to your condition. Wrel. Definitely. DefinitelyI try to. I always try to. I don't know if you do this or not, but I try tomeditate and it's I struggle, but I just I make myself at least do likefive minutes a day I'm like. If I can do this. If I can sit down- and I cando five minutes of meditating a day- I don't even care if it takes me a yearto get this down. I'm like, if I can do this, you know for a salad like year,then I know that I've accompliced it makes me feel good to know that I cando that, but like when I've started to do this and I've started to get intothis spiritual stuff. I've started to become a lot more aware of who I am andwhy I do the things that I do and that I'm accepting that I'm an angry. I wasan angry person, I'm not so much ow, but right so you ha. You have anger.That's I like Tho frame it like that. You have an, but you can choose thecomputer or get rid of it. I guess right exactly in different situationslike you know, like they'll, be situations that will pop up. You knowon different days where I can choose like. Do you want to act like how youcould or do you know I mean like I do become way more conscious of how I'mgoing to react in situations, and sometimes I mean, let's all you phase-that fifty percent of the time slip of a coin yeah. Fifty percent of the time I can, youknow, kind of get myself out of it and then it'll. Take me less time as if Iwas to react, and then it takes me about five hours to get stap out of itand realize. Oh, I probably shouldn't act it like that. You know so it's just.It's just helps you on stay on path right, so you don't drive yourself offinto a ditch, exactly like I, there are days like we talked about where, yes, Idon't want to do a damn thing. I don't want to talk to anybody. I just want tolike you, wake up in addict yeah, but I know that deep down and I'm proud of myself forthis- that what it is. I know that it's just my you know this, this mentalstuff going on or these things going on, and I need to just get myself up andget through it and you know just be be cautious when I wake up like that,because I have to be careful of the situations I put myself in, that'sright, don't let I take you yeah exactly which can be hard. It can bereally really hard or challengin it's hard to be conscious, like it's hard tobe like. I don't want to say, woke, it's not the the right context here,but it's hard to be conscious of the the inner workings of your own mind.The moment you wake up. I've tried, I try meditating right. Itried the visualization, but ive also dried the the Montra one. What do yousay a thing or you hear repetitive words over and over yeah expoken wordor something like that. The spoken word...

...works better. For me. I have a weirdthing called afantasia I just found out about where I can AC. I can't actually seeanything in my mind when someone says okay, close your eyes and imagine anapple like. I know what an apple looks like, but when I close my eyes it'sjust black there's nothing there. I can't see anything in my mind wow, so it so have you ever tried to ifsomebody's asked you fut like you could like draw something, though right ifsomebody was like hey draw something EU m, I'm a brand designer I', like mostof my living, I make from designing Grans for corporation, so it's yeah,I'm a creative person, and I never once thought that I couldn't visualize untilsomeone says no, I actually see an apple like no, you don't really seeSeean apple and they're ake yeah yeah, I'm like! Is it like? Well red he'slike yeah, it's red, it's got a brown stem and green little thing like Ohyeah. Now I just see black just black anyway, my point being when I do someof the meditation and they say picture yourself walking along a beach. I'mlike H, it's black just, is dark in here. Well that I can't do the visual eitherand honestly. You want to know why I can't do it. It' I mean you're. Iobviously don't have you know what is it called that you said it wasAffantasia, it's like santasia with the A in front of it affintit kind ofsounds cool, but I don't have that, but the thevisualization part and th the doing that I just get distracted. I can'teven meditate I'm like well now you want me to walk in the beach and thenI'm trying to see myself. You know it just that was that was it with me and Iwil. I finally put her all together about six months ago. I'm like, Oh,that's, why I get distracted, because I can't actually see what the fuck youris like sitting in a movie theater and everyone else is seeing the screen andI'm just sitting here in the dark and everyone's like: Oh and laughing andclapping I'm like yeah I'll, do what they're doing anplay along, because I never knew that that could actually see the screen and,like Oh, you cant, you cound see something Whoa, but but I like the repeating thingswhen someone says you, you have a right to an abundantlife. You have a right to UN o some shit like that right that works for mebecause then, like we talked about earlier, our self talk. If you jamyourself talk with a bunch of positive messages, there's really no space inyour day for negative Selftalk, so I kind of aspire to that m yeah. I doManthas. I actually just that's what something just within the last fewmonths that I'm like you know what mantras are just the way that I'm haveto go to meditate, because I have a the the beads. So I just do it a hundredand eight times and I'm not going to lie. I get to like the halfway mark andI have to literally call mind calm your mind. Calm your mind start, you knowand keep going R that I just because if I could but and that's all it takes,and I can do it and- and I actually like impressed myself- I was like okay,if I can do this for- and I think it takes me about five to ten minutes. IfI do the mantra you know it feels just so good to justget the accomplish and calm my mind for that five o ten minutes- and I knowthat I eventually can get you know, hopefully to the point where it's halfhour to an hour. You know and then, where I can consciously do it on everyday rather than just for those five ten minutes. Do that's kind of my thoughtabout it. Do you think that's why? Like Catholics, for example, do therosary with the beads for do you think it's for the same effect? No, you think it has the same effect. It might it might. I don't know that.That's a good, that's a good question yeah the way you described it, I'm likeHuh, because I've seen like my friends grandma when his dad passed- and youknow the mom was still alive, had to Barry Her son. She would sit at the atthe grave site for days days on it not...

...like you know, unreasonable, Mat time,but like two hours or so just counting, saying Rosaryan pushing those beatsthrough her fingers. Well, theire Therapeu, dday, no yeah th,but now that you say that an that that technically and that we could go onto awhole nother conversation about like Jesus and and Budda and stuff, becauseI actually like read a lot on them and how Jesus really was a Yogi, andyou know how he came to like him and Buddha were actually the ones that werecoming to. You know talk about divine and being your divine self and- and youknow your inner God and things like that. I can talk about stuff like thatfor forever, because that's something that I really enjoy alove and I feellike it's inspired me to you- know what I meen tobe a better person but anyways yeah shut. I can talk about that forever,but I was just saying that the the beeds that we use- and you know thatwhole idea behind it, I think, is really to just be to be a strongerperson. Yeah like it's to be more mindfully, strong and and to be, andmaybe just connect on on a different level. You know sometimes people dopray to kind of just leave the leave this world, I think and be in aspiritual realm for that amount of time. You know, I don't know yeah and if wehave the capacity to do that, why not try it exactly exactly cant, you don't see acat sitting around the backyard trying to reach a different higher capacity ofspiritualism. I don't know, maybe maybe that is whatthey're doing. I don't know what they're doing out there. No I thisthat's what I'm saying like. I could have so many different conversations,because I'm so open minded about everything, and you know some peoplethink I'm crazy and some people are like yeah. That's totally. I totallyget what you're going with that. You know right right. Some people arewilling to. I guess it's almost like improvisational skill. You See, I watcha lot of improve comedy and things like that, and I think it's really neat howpeople will pick up the Batan that somebody hands them, regardless of whatit is so to be able to take a topic thatyou're, not as sure of but hey I'll, see where it's going, I think, is areally cool capacity of humans. Oh Yeah! Definitely hundred percent!That's you mentioned crazy so that I'm going to call the cat the title of thispodcast coming out crazy, disclosing your mental differences. So you SOISA put differences in therebecause yeah I'm not going to label anybody. I got to include all of thethe people who feel left out exactly so then yeah go ahead. No, but I was going to say besides Iwas going to ask you you know. Besides doing like the themeditation and stuff in Canafis like what are other, what are some thingsthat you do like in your daily life, like on yourtask, to kind of keep you you know, keep you going throughout theday. I'm just curious, if, like you know, maybe they until now. Likerecently, I got a job and that is pretty well structured like Wat tomy benefit right, because I don't have to think of what I have to do ha plotout what I have to do the night before and I go out and do it the next day done right, so my cool that is actuallyhelpful to our earlier point, though it's fucking stressful on thosemornings where you just don't want to do shit, but you know like fuck. Thisis my big chance. If I don't get up now, life is like the word living or twhatotally catastrophise it, but so it has a challenges, but nonetheless. I have structured before that, like all of covid most of the year, I love coming up with new ideas, so Isit around and think of a new company. A new nonprofit, a new podcast idea sobecause I'm a designer and I m working...

...on other clients logos, sometimes I'mthinking man if they only had this well, then I pretend- and I invent that thingI'll go by the domain name and the twitter handle, put a logo up, and I'mjust fuck around make these fake entities that look super professional,but they don't really do anything. So it just kind of keeps my design in mymy workflow muscles I in shape- I guess m yes, so well is so that's somethingso you're talking about like the Designe, so you don't necessarily like always get paid for that. That'smore of like a hobby thing that you do and you kind of just put it out there.And then you see! No, it's more. Like my asperger thing, it's the one thingI'm fucking super into because I do get pad forit like I get paid for it from amarketing form. I workforce every time they got nou LO. Those designs for likeI just did one for like a easy go kind of market like chain of truck stops andthings like that and a newspaper company, and then theire cable companyand at phone companies. So I'm doing these big logo projects, but it's notenough for me because it's so confining they want you to just do it like an andall and what really drives me crazy is all fucking come up with the idea on awhim, while I'm sitting on the toilet and I'll whip it out and like if theysay yes Ti Tis, then they're idiots and like the next morning. They are likeperfect fucking kidding me so now, sojus H ss,but I'm like whatever I get paid, none the less, but I feel so cheap like I'mlike a hooker or something, but I get Li. I felt like that before too, withsome stuff that I've dot an that and it's been good. You know it's not a badtransaction or anything that I do but you're just yeah like and I'm not atwork. Din't really do much like, and I don't mean to be smirced the sextraidt either, because I support that fully so sorry to any hookers listening but t just that's weird, but no, it ismy thing I fucking I watch documents like I just watch a documentary on afont called Hel Vedica for like the third time, I'm just into shit like that ias likeWhoa Cool Yeah. No, that's cool, that's cool that you can get. I'm weird likeI'm weird and like find like I'll get a moment where I just want to be creativeand I'll, just create like I'll, do kind of not like logos but like I'llpaint, pictures or I'll get on Camba and I'll do fun things for, like myfacebook or you know, maybe I feel like doing a video or something so I'll haveon youtube. Like that's the kind of thing that I do you know I just I do. Ifeel like like content creation. So like that's what I'm saying like I feellike similar in a sense like I do have fun like like yeah. It's like you gotto keep your creative flow, yeah th open. You can't stifle it there's! Noway it's going to come out some way like when my kids were young. I would wreck things because, like likemy son came home and they were starting a pumpkin patch next to thei, classroomright and I'm like fuck yeah. We could get like a Web camp and Yo put like myPumpkin patchcom and we could have updates and toe run screaming out ofthe room. Mom Dad's reckon it it's so funny. I just go into anm like yeah. Icould be a thing and like Ineso my mind, everything can be a thing and it's soexhausting sometimes, but it keeps me you know, structure keeps me doingthings yeah and you just get some. Sometimesyou get like super duper excited about it. That's how I get I'll get like soso excited a like. I have to do this thing. Like you, don't understand, THAshappen, yeah, fuck, yeah, that's a traide of adhd is we have an affinityfor the novel, so anything new. It's like yeah, yeah, fucking love the newand it once it's not new. It kind of gets, throw cast aside a little bit t slike boring, whatever yeah, but it's a rush for the new. I love it...

...okay. So let's talk about the pros and cons of quote unquotecoming out as crazy and what it really means to every individual, because it's sodifferent each time right m so have you like on obviously on this podcastyou've come out as crazy? Who knows how many people are going to hear this inyour world but like, for example, your fiance knows, but what about? Even likeyour family or your coworkers, or your old friends from school? How manypeople know what you've been going through, regardless of the validity ofany label? How many actually know you've been going to slike, see adoctor and trying to work things out actually beside yeah? Besides my fiance,he obviously knows everything every single thing and I'm my grandma and it actually to like kind of on theside note on this conversation or this this question I don't actually have a solidrelationship with with my family. I actually only you know, talk to my grandmothertechnically and, like I have my daughter, you know so her and I aregood, but, like friends wise, I haven't really ever came out and toldthem what I struggle with on on a daily basis. I've. Never I've, never told myfriends that you know. Like I wake up, and I have days where I just I hate theRo, like kind of like the conversation that I've had with you, I don't I don'topen up about those things. I just kind of blame it on. You know the excuseslike I'll I'll say. Oh you know, I'm sorry like I couldn't get back with you,because you know its doing this or something like that because you don'twant to you. Don't want to admit that I can' reallylike how many times I've hadfood poisoning before you know right and and it's so and then I and then Igo back and I think like daing and my a bad friend, you know what I mean andthen I start to like distance myself for my friends and stuff, sorelationships H, ve and I'll admit this I'll admit it right now, since I'vebeen telling everybody everything else anyways, you know I struggle, Istruggle with relationships. I really do and I don't a purpose yeah. What's thehardest thing, with keeping a relationship intact and I'massuming, like friends aside from your fiance and you child, but like is itthere is a thing, especially with our peers, people or age, whether they'reat work or old, schoolmates or anything, it's just hard to keep those going. Sowhat's your biggest challengin the relationship thing, I think it's just the. I think it's thecommunication part for sure, because, like I've been telling you, I don'tlike to admit the flaws that I have or things that I do wrong. So it's easierfor me to just portray that you know like I might have a bad day or two, butI don't actually struggle with it. Every day yeah you sound like the kindof person that would acknowledge that you are having a bad day. So I don'tthink yeah. You know what I mean, because I kind of feel the same way.Sometimes too I'll acknowledge it. I just don't know when people can noticeit honestly right Kright, I'm just because me I'm just being me going through myday today and yeah some days I might appear way more toxic than others, butif people don't say hey dude, what's up, then I just won't know and theneventually that silence will will gnaw at everybody and relationships will gettattered that way M or you know like just going through like Iwas th, for example, you know just a few years ago I was just going throughthis, like I don't I'm assuming you know what you would call like. Areally depressive episode to where, like I just didn't, know what was whatI was drinking all the time. You know again, like I picked it back up and I just kind of blew my friends offlike I had no good reason for it. I had,...

...but I just picked up, I moved out, youknow moved out of their house. I didn't talk to him and it was all because ofthese internal things that I was trying to deal with, but I didn't want to tellthem you know I didn't want to explain to them like what was going on, becauseI didn't know what was going on. You know just and I don't even like evitting thiseither, but you know just talking to different guys that I don't need to betalking to. You know what I mean that don't do anything for me and it just I don't know, and then Ilost a lot of. I lost a lot of people. You know a lot of friends because of itand then I like, I said now, I'm to the point where I recognize somany things, probably because I'm older of why Iwasn't able to hold those relationships, and it was just because I wasn't neverhonest about what was really going on yeah yeah, that's true. I have this additional aditional insight, exs atthe same kind of feeling and more it started to percolate to the surface.Later I guess during Covid and whatnot is I have this weird thing where I kindof unless I can try to unless I could present the perfect me, or at least thebest me to people. I want to put that on hold I'm like wait. Wai, wait, I'mkind of fucked up right now. I don't want you to see me so fucked up. Youknow you never get the best of me and I feel bad about that like I'm. If Icould say that to my my mom, my dad, my kids, every lover I've ever had, Idon't feel they've ever got the best of me and I feel really shameful that that they didn't get the best of me andthey may never get the best of me and it's so fucked up, because sometimeswhen I feel like I'm the best me, I can be there's absolutely nobody around toshare it with MM. No, I feel I feel the exact sameway like I an an for example like when I'm meditating and I'm calm, and youknow stuff like that. I think to myself. Why can I not be like this? You knowlike it's to everybody on on a daily basis like. Why can I just be calm andand collectit, you know, and then I'm hard on myself t an you get hard onland- and I think that's why messes it up. Doyou think being labelled fucks with your head? That way, yeah definitely there's a kind of aquestion when people like people say well was your diagnose as e help or ahindrance and at first I thought it was helpful because it gave me I guess, cover for my behavior, I'mlike oh well, there is a reason, there's a legitimate reason andhonestly it helped me not be an addict because I realizedpart of my behavior was based on trying to end the suffering with withchemicals and whatever. So that was helpful, but I get really excited about Shit rightwhen I find out something new. I want to share it well right when one of thethings you have is a mental disorder at the time and one of the symptoms of is poorjudgment, and then you start sharing with everybody your mental disorder.Well, that's where I think I really made a mistake like that. I wouldn'thave shared it with half the people, because I was sharing it with everybody.I do it now anonymously. That's why I don't really put my face all over theplace and I don't use my real last name or anything, because I still feel it'simportant for people to share, but man you got to really be careful with whoyou share with no, you do definitely, and that andthat's another thing too, is that I think that a part of you know whatever we try whatever wecalour differences, we're I'm going to call it that our different that we havein our brains. You know, just I don't know just thinking about tryingto explain it to somebody. You almost feelstupid. You know like you, don't necessarily I don't want to say theword stupid, but yeah. No, I mean, if you feel it that's. I know they're notgon to get it like. I just feel like...

...okay, I know you're not going to get itso why should I say here and explain it to you t because you're either going tosay? Oh, you know you're fine, like whatever like move on. You know becauseI've had people say that, or you know people get so into it, but they' likeoh my gosh like do you think it's this and do you have you tried this and thenyou're like you, don't want to hear it yeah everybody wants to fix you, L yeah,like the stubbornness, that's what I was trying to get at is how stubborn Iam I'm stupid, stubborn like and the maybe it's a woman thing I don't know,but I have I've literally been this way. Since I've been three years old, youcan ask my grandma, like literally stubborn, to the core, and I hate it.You know in that I feel like as a big part of the relationships to is. Youknow with me expressing myself to people as like. I don't want to hearwhat you have to say about it or tell me how to fix it or tell me ow do thi,no, that's valid, though I mean sometimes yeah. We just want to beheard because I o mean, if I can't, if, if a doctor wasn't able to fix it, if adozen doctors weren't able to fix it and all these meds that I listedweren't able to fix it. I don't expect my best friend to fix it or my mom ormy kids or anything, but I do expect them to hear me out and listen and tryto understand e, then not even try that hard mean just pop open the Internet.Once in a while and look up pick an Ailmet, you know look into it and tryto understand that that is real and it's not it's not a gimmick or anythingwit someone's going to have a gimmick like I got a mental disorder forfucking thirty years. Who would who would do that? Doesn't make any sense? I know and yeah, and I and I don't likein like you when you were going back to when you said, was it helpful back thenyeah? I thought it was helpful, but like now I tried to do everything I canto not even use the word by polar adhd. hyperactive manic depress that you knowI don't even want to Gos and those words I don't. I don't think I go theother direction sometimes like I use the slang for some of these terms, andpeople in the mental health field get angry at me because I'm using slang forcrazior Spaz or things like this did you know in the UK. The WORD SPAS is asoffensive as the word CUNT IS IN AMERICA? Oh Wow! No. I did not knowthat, but it's flicked, because in the UK cunt is in that fucking offensiveand, like we'll see the week, we just have a difference of opinion. I'm goingto keep saying spas and I'm going to refrain from the seaword as much aspossible, except that example. So I mean the words are just fun. Some kind oflike the hoposexual community took back gayand fag, and things like this right. We don't normally say them, but they'refree to use them and all of the any kind of movement takes back their words,and I think it's fine for people with any kind of mental style to take backthe words and use them as you as you feel mm yeah. No totally, because I Imean I'm a believer in words. Are I mean it's so hard to say this like nowadaysbut like? If you really really really think about it, like words are justwords and you can use them it's in the context and the way that you'recarrying that word yeah for sure to do. You know like you can like. I can sayyou know, you're an asshole like or like you're an asshole. You know I meanlike ter's so much. You know just like just that, like they're, just so muchdifferent like in the word vey right in t e context, because I live in Oklahomanow and if, when you're talking to some people a they say they, you knowclearly that they mean black people and they're fucking racist. You know what Imean so words are like knives. They could be used to butter your toast orstab somebody in the heart. Words can hold the power, but the person sayingthem is where the power comes from. So as people who you know, experiencethese differences, I think it's important that we take back the labelsand say things how we wish yeah. Definitely, this show originally wascalled bipolar style because I'm like is it a disorder? Idon't know aside from sitting in my closet in the dark when I'm superdepressed and crying my eyes out the...

...other parts, not so bad. It kind ofhelps me function get over the lowness of the depression, so it's almostinbalanced balanced. I guess is the way I'm sayingso. The ups and downs, the highs and lows, if you were to stretch them outover time, equal one flat line, so I live life a little more high and lowthan a flat line, but you know look at the ekg machine if you're flat lineyou're dead, exacly, that's a good way. That'sdefinitely a good comparison up and down up and down a little bit up andhere yeah. Well, it's fun to think of that way. I's like yeah, you, normalpeople are just living a flat line. Life boyring exactly exactly. Butanother thing I was going to say to is: I did come out to Aall boss of mine, I'm actually selfemployed now, but Icame out to old boss of mine. About being you know, I use the label likeI'm bipolar, and this is what I struggled with because she she came tome and she was like. I noticed that you're, starting, like things, arestarting to get tough for you and I notice you're coming in later, and youknow like you're, taking advantage of like leaving earlier and things likethat, and so I had the talk and I just started crying. I was like well now. Ihave to say something because I just started crying. I wasn't even talkingand I just started bursting out in tears and I just was like you know. Istruggle with just all of these emotions and I just came out- and Itold her and like in that moment I felt like it wasn't necessarily because Ifelt comfortable, I think its because I thought I wasn't lose my job right. Youknow what I mean so and in and I don't know if you know this and I'm sure youprobably do but like in applications, they will ask you if you struggle withthe mental, what what do they say in the application instead of a mentaldisability or something like that, yeah like something like that and they will,they will put you know they put my polar and things like that on therelike. So it's like yeah, I'm going to admit this now sure, of course right upfront right and that kind of like and when I saw that because you know I wasin and out, I've worked since I've been fifteen, you know so I know what jobapplications look like an over time. It changed and I'm thinking of myself like.Why are you asking people that yeah and he ask it's like well? This doesn'treally count. We don't keep track of this stuff, but we're going to ask, areyou my polar? Are you an Indian? Are you this a'm like what who the fuckwants to know right? I did right exactly so I'm just like thinking tomyself like who is going to get this information and who wants to know ifI'm, if I struggle you know with what people, if you're asking me thisquestion, you must think it matters right. It must matter to you, I havethis or not so then I got kind of judgmental in the workforce. Thinkinglike I don't want to work for anybody, because I'm going to have to admit thatI have something. Do I have to admit it? You know this is where the cons come in.Like that's, why I'm saying I can't because people there's, I know, there'sthousands millions of other people that struggle- I mean, maybe not millions,but you know thousands of people that struggle with these same things, notexacty sayme. They don't have the same story, you know, but they feel thatsame type of way. Looking at a job application, like are you like? Are youfucking serious, like really tell you this yeah like and then, and then youget emotional about it like? I don't even want to admit to anybody. Soespecially okay. Let's dig just a one step deeper on the bipolar disorder,specifically because that was probably the most damaging and mostcontroversial diagnosis I've ever had in my life. I shared that, like I said I was excited, I found ananswer: it's okay, everybody! I'M NOT AN ASSEHOLE! It just have bipoladisorder, so apparently everyone's like yeah. We figured fucking asshole likegreat thanks for you to support anyway. So I left down and went left from SanFrancisco to Los Angeles, where I went to work for Ikay millennial, runcompany Super Cool Lovetexatech Company,...

...like we built software and we had noconference tables anywhere in the office, was all about community andsitting and exposing your souls. So My dumbass of course says: Hey Yeah. Ihave bi polar disorder. Just found out skipped Te. Do I just tell this to fucking room, ith,fifteen people? I just started work with right and my supervisors and theCEO of the company and all the shit well later. Then, if you ever fuck upat work, it's just so easily dismissed up up it's the bipolar disorder is likeno fen. The fuckerds, like you didn't trade me on that one thing I asked fivetimes to be trained on O it's the bipollor disorder. Oh now he's actingup, thats, the bipolor disorder, or now this n now he's calling in sick. Nowthat must be the bipos. So you know you just become everything. Becomes yourfucking diagnosis? That's where I'm like! Now, let's not do that again. Ifyou know what I mean they would have, everybody would have thought ofdifferent things if or maybe got to the root of the problem. If fifteendifferent people thought of me fifteen different ways, but the moment I gavethem that Amo, the bipolar disordered label instantly, all fifteen could cometo a consensus that Oh, he must be fucked up because of the bipolardisorder which you know may or may not be true mm. No exactly or you know thethe on that side and then on the flipside to of kind of how we weretalking about when you just you blame it on the bipolar yourself. You knowlike Oh yeah, like you know, and then you start to think you start to thinkthat that's what happened to me was. I started to just be like. Oh well, it'sjust because of this, so I guess I just have to deal with it. You know what Imean like or oh I guess I'm acting like this because of that. But now for youto say you know to hear other people say it like that that just makes it tentimes even more difficult to get yourself off of that thought that youdon't have. You know that you shouldn't have that label or yea shouldn't eforsure like like in the end, does having the label do more help or ta more hurt, so I believe it does more hurt. I reallydo I mean probably just from the experience that I've had it hasn't. Ithasn't helped me her's, here's the other thing too. So it also dependseven in your social circles, what you have so I did an episoderecently on what I call this safety net, that many people don't have, and here'swhyt like consider a net is a bunch of ropes connected where they cross bylittle fixed years will call them nodes right to keep them separated as a net. So each of those little nodes is aperson in your social life, your family, your friends, a coworkers and thenthere's just a bunch of rope playing around well most of the people. I knowthe rope is not connected to the noses in any kind of safety nets right. So,if you're falling the people you know will not cometogether, they don't even know each other. In most cases like your coworkerwon't call your brother, your sister, your Fami mean there's, obviouslyethical lines, but still amongst your friends, they don't talk amongst eachother. If they all say you got fifty facebook friends, for example, and allof them know you're hurting, but none of them talk to each other. You don'treally have a net yeah. Conversely, if you tell people about your diagnosesafter you've, hit the ground and almost died, sometimes that net will almostbecome like a capturenet. They will you'll be held back now, instead ofthat net, ever being your safety thet, now you're stuck in it because peopleof mouth they got you where they want. You, oh he's mentally ill cool. I caneasily categorize that person in my mind, move on with my life and well. Ihope I hope the best form, but I can't help him. Oh my gosh, and it no and when you werean you said when you met mentioned family, you know that's another thingthat that's exactly how it works too, like you can...

...not be really okay, just for example.Right now. I just know this is what would happen so right now you knowthings. Are you know going? Okay in my life, I have sal, you know what I mean.I have some PA, really positive things going. You know. I really don't have alot to complain about yeah at always acknowledge the blessings for sureright right, but if I have but I you know, we do have those momentssometimes weeks where we hit rock bottom for a minute and we just got Ta.You know we really have to work hard to pick ourselves back up. But if I was tohave this moment where, like I really lost it, you know I lost it and I hadto go to the hospital and I was medicated guess who would be at myfront door, my entire family. You know what I mean like my Stepmom, my dad,you know what I mean to be there to catch me to be like. Oh my gosh. Youknow this whole time. You were just struggling with this and you know youknow what I saing Ani yeah. That's awesome. I knew that existed somewhereyeah and you know so so. Basically, you know and like you have this but like,but at the same time you know they don't like right now, like struggling withthese little things that I do have you know they're like oh well, you're, justacting like this person, you're acting like your mon ID, you take your midsyeah yeah, exactly that's Davr Yeah! So it's just! I don't know it's just it'sso hard because, like I feel like coming out and havingthat label and then telling you know telling your family, especially like,let's go on this a little bit, you know wit your depending at who your familyis and how your family, you know how you were brought up like some people,would really feel extremely uncomfortable, telling their parentsthat they suffer from a mental disorder, and I'm talking you know they expectbetter out of you yea. They expect you to be this person or be this greatbasketball player. You know, I'm just throwing stuff out know, but most othercultures to like America is unique and it yeah in that will acknowledge it more.But other countries don't like India, the Asian countries in particular African countries. Thisis all like very stigmatized. You do not acknowledge mental illness. That ispurely a weakness. It's not the mental illness you're just having a fuckingbad day, get over wake up tomorrow and change your life mm. They don't they. Idon't want to say they don't believe in it, but they don't really acknowledgeit yeah and that o o Aheadit's not a it's, not a denial of science thing.It's a very entrenched in the culture theyg much like in the way that inJapan, Japanese culture, they don't aspire to be happy. The the conditionof happiness is not a thing to them. So in much in the same way of all thedifferent parts of the world, the condition of being mentally ill is justyour thinking wrong. Think differently, yeah right, but that you know it'sGreat Eah as crazy that you bring that up. Because that's something about you know with the when you s Hindu,religion in particular, you know they don't it's not about, like you're,never going to get to a happiness. It's always like you, you know what I meanyour whole life, like you, don't you're not trying to search for happinessyou're just supposed to be. You know in the moment, every single, like secondof your life, pety much like that. They try to tell you like it's not aboutbeing happy every day, it's about being in each in every single moment of everypart of your day and never you know going back on on your your a and now back to the wall.

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