Signal Drops
Signal Drops

Episode 128 · 1 month ago

John Emotions Interviews Listener "J" ... Bipolar + Bipolar

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

John Emotions talks to dedicated Emo Dojo Mofo known only as "J." 

J shares his bipolar journey from a young kid through a late-in-life diagnosis that changed the way he thinks about it all. 

This podcast episode is a good example of two functioning adults who both happen to be diagnosed with (at least) bipolar disorder having a discussion on what it's really like to live — and often thrive — with brain differences.

Follow John Emotions on Twitter @johnemotions

Original audio available free, and commercial-free at emodojo.com

What's up, mofos. How you doing? New Friends, I'm John Emotions and this is Emodo Joe. Today's episode is a really cool episode. It's with a listener named Jay and it really represents one of the main reasons I do a podcast, is that I get to talk to strangers, talk to people have never met and see what we have in common. So I love it. Turns out to be a really good conversation. He's very similar to me, you know, middle aged, wike eye, diagnosed with bipolar later in life, and we share many of the same ups and down some you probably share at these two regardless of your gender, race or age. You know, what I did find was interesting, and this is kind of becoming a pattern. I think I'm getting good at first timers, people that have never shared their story to the world, coming on the show and sharing a story. So it's happened several times in the past a few months. So that's kind of cool. If you have a mental illness and have never talked about it and want to talk about it, you could do it like jays about to completely anonymous. You know, is nothing secretive about it, but you know, we explain why we keep our names you know, somewhat hidden because those stigma involved, but yeah, you know, letting first time or share their stories and showing the world that people with bipolars disorder can do normal things. Like, basically, we can do everything everyone else does. We're just a little more interesting. We go to word work, we make podcasts, have conversation with strangers and generally try to do right by others. If you're into that kind of thing, then this is the right place. EMO DOJO is for you. So let's open up the doors to the Dojo and talk to Jay. Here's Jay in the EMO Dojo. I'M gonna go by Jay. That's right, totally cool. Yeah, no, especially this because I've been fired because people found out how a podcast back in the day, and then the bosses everything became more like, oh, of John Miss work, maybe it's because he has bipolar. Or if John's acting up or speaking his voice, maybe it's because he has bipolar. I'm like, Oh, for fuck's sake, dude, it wasn't until you found out about the podcast. Right. Yeah, it's crazy how that works, right. Yeah, all right, dude. So I'm yeah, I will refer to you as Jay and if we won't, we will get into any details about necessarily where you were. Will say we're, you know, in America or something like that, and talk as much as you want to about as much detail, and then we'll take it from there. Okay, yeah, because it's pretty casual. Like it. You've heard the show before. I'm like, I try to try to be accommodating and let people say as much as they want and after I listen back, I usually let it are out for a couple days. Then I listen to it again and if we say anything that is Cringey, makes us would embarrass our kids or might get us fired at work, like particularly me, because so I don't know who actually knows, but I know my enemies no out my podcast and if they really wanted to, they would share it with my bosses. So I don't say anything that would get be quote unquote, canceled, and I pretty much avoid politics completely, although I think most of my listeners know my political persuasion. I don't like. It's not a political show. Cool. Yeah, I I mean I can ramble on so a bit. You'll pend to cut me off bad. I'm totally cool with that. No issues whatsoever. Awesome to it. Awesome let's I'm going to kill my camera. Then there's a little button along the bottom, just as cam. We just click that and we'll shut off your camera. Okay, welcome back to Emo Dojo. I'm here today with a listener who actually hit me up and signed out the guest request for him to be on the show with and this is perfect because Jay here, we'll call him Jay. Jay, like me, easy to remember, and so he wrote this cool description of his life and I'm like, Oh, yeah, it's pretty much my life and I thought it would be need for you, the listener, to hear how similar all of our lives are and yet how normal we actually are. So this is great. I'm it's awesome to have you, Jay. Thanks for reaching out and being so bold as to go on a podcast, and we'll get into your experience the podcasting in a few minutes, but thanks, man, come on in. Thanks for having you, John. It's not something I don't think it's something you ever intend to do, or at least I didn't. And then just listening to you, AH, over long time now. I work outside and and you know I kind of get bored sometimes with playing the same tunes, not that I don't have a big library of stuff, but like the education part of podcast and the fun stuff. Fan, you do both really well. Sot To be here. Yeah, I appreciate that. I do the same thing. I drive a lot and I listened to a lot of stuff and sometimes I've just had it with music. I love music. I play music and my the vibes in my brain. I'm like, okay, I need some talking, give me some talking. I'm with you there, man. It just kind of happens in your life. Yeah, and then it flips, you know,...

I listen to a podcast or too much of an audio book and I'm like, Oh, what is missing from my life? I'll music, get back to the music. So, yeah, jump back and forth. Yeah, that's really neat. Dude. What do you what is Your Day job right now? I am in maintenance and kind of always been a maintenance it's been, you know, pools and pools and hut tubs for quite a long time and then moved, like a lot of us, by polar folks do move several times. So I'm not sure how much we can get into that, but too, that's the job, man. Yeah, but I mean that is part of the thing right. I mean the the details of your job are less important than the fact that, like you said, we change jobs and living locations so frequently, and it's not by design. I would love to have a stable, normal existence, but for some reason, about every fucking thousand days I'm up and going somewhere that I never ever would have planned to be. I mean, I get it immediately as the worst come out of your mouth because, like you said, you know, a lot of our experiences are are pretty close, and moving just seems to be one of those where you just Kinda and I always seem to kind of get it to year thing at work and then I'm kind of done. Right. Yeah, so, yeah, it's you know, you know what. So seven hundred or so days or eight hundred and twenty? Yeah, I just I just jumped under the metric system. I seem like it's roughly three years. But is it a whole three years? Like, no, it's not. quiets more than two and like, Huh, let's call it a thousand days edge for fun. When did you two and five years drawn yeah, yeah, and it could be. I mean, if I'm in a better situation, I lasted ten years before I knew I was bipolar. I had bipolar and that was cool. But because if you did, here we can get into that too, about the labeling and the diagnosis. So you were diagnosed late in life, like me. What was it like in school when you were young? Were you weird? Were you a smart kid like? Well, like, how did that all fold out? Say, Grade School? Well, I kind of blacked out a good bit of my childhood and I'm sure there's some reasons for that that you know, probably not going to get it too here. Yeah, so kind of kind of more pick up around middle school, sixth grade or so. And and yeah, I never thought that I was the weird kid. But look at look at it things now after the diagnosis. I mean, how could I not think I was the weird kid at this point? But where you the weird kid, like in school, because kids are weird, right, kids are generally weird and they're all exploring our little our little beans and and prior to that, like, just just for the record, I was shit, I'll say abused, because I was beating. I didn't like to be hit. So I was abused, neglected and then finally abandoned as a kid, as a child. So if I'm assuming a lot of those type of things made. It may have happened to you in various levels of in degrees right, yes and no. So interesting. Family was, you know, a very non confrontational family, very much. You know, just work. You know, work hard, and as long as you work hard you can pretty much kind of kind of do whatever you want, you know, as long as sure, yeah, put out some effort and don't just say slack off, because your parents are probably like mine, born in the s early s or something like that. Absolutely yeah, and you know they're great folks. And you know, it's kind of a dual ledge store because when you're in need to help, which I was looking for in my really my late teens and early S, you know, a kind of you know, at that point it was pretty taboo and you know my what I told him. I I just don't even know what's going on. I've got some issues up upstairs here and you know, I basically want to jump out of my skin. It took like some it seemed like it was like plotting to like call this person to like maybe, you know, they know psychiatrist or therapist and you know, as kind of this like yeah, the secretly machadasi yeah, the parents get into let's find a way to get this settled. Yeah, so I was I think I ended up being probably somewhere around twenty three, you know, when this happened. But I was already, you know, I already kind of knew that my my brain didn't work right really in my, you know, Middle Teens. You know, I was kind of figuring out stuff like man, this doesn't make sense. Yeah, well, kind of things bro came to your attention that started to make you think that this can't be normal party much when? Let's see. So, you know, I played, you know, soccer good bit when I was young and you know, my dad coached all...

...my teams and you know, so parts of that were good. And then he would start talking about things that happen when I was like eight or nine and I wasn't much older than that, maybe thirteen to fourteen, and I just flat out had no memory of that stuff. So that's weird. How we do that. Yeah, it's like, you know, I mean in I guess your brain like protect you when that a so, yeah, if they're you know, if there was some pretty horrible trauma, which obviously there's something there, you know, kind of shuts it out and, yeah, or even embarrassing things I remember, like even like as an adult now, I remember something that happened into how third or fourth grade, and I'm like, Oh wow, that's why I'm the way I am now and I never even thought about it until now. You know, fifty years light or some shit. I'm like, wow, that's why it's it's it's pretty. I mean, I hate to keep, you know, to throw a rather word crazy, but it is crazy. Get like a diagnosis in your middle de Lte s and then you have to go back and try to kind of reconcile see if match higher life. Yeah, and it's just like man, this is like absolutely dreadful. I'm not sure if it's if it's worse beed like undiagnosed bipolar with like a bud light coping mechanism, or being diagnosed and, you know, or not being diagnosed right like, because I always wonder about that, because I go, I'm off and on. Even like twenty years later after I've been diagnosed, I'm like, well, maybe they were wrong, maybe it was something else. And then a couple days later I'll have an issue or an episode and of a couple weeks after that I'll black out on the episode that I had and I'm like, Oh yeah, and so it's a constant cycle. Like I think I'm cool, I think I'm over it, I'm like I think I'm older and I'm healing, and then I look back the shit that just happened six months ago or a year ago or like Oh man, that's as intense as any of my crazier episodes as a kid. Yes, it's, man, there's there's just so much to it, and I almost, you know, I kind of get how, you know people without it, you know, if they, you know, see us or here about us or like like however gets to you know. It's just like I'm trying to figure out how to deal with this and manage it. So if you find out that, you know, I've a brain disorder, I am bipolar, I have it. I don't care how it's phrase. And Yeah, you know, it's just like if I'm figured out, like how the heck do they have a chance of like even remotely knowing outside of what they've seen in pop culture and movies? You know, just like right, you know, this guy can like lose his crap here. If they're even willing to try sex. And Yeah, and a lot of times they're not even willing to try. They're like, Nope, that guy's just next yeah, he's he's just too crazy, he's out of control, right Dickhead. Yeah, you know, stuff like that, and that's not a lie. I mean now, all that is true too. Yeah, but I could only imagine the angel that would come out of the the ether to actually stick around long enough to, you know, deal with me, because I can't even deal with me. So I don't understand how. Yeah, I'm basically I guess I just understand why I'm alone at this hate I have too bad. It's you know, at some point, I think it's weird to kind of get used to being alone and not having a huge friend list. And Yeah, I mean that part just lends itself like kind of to the weirdness. But at the same point, like you know, we're pretty good humans with really good hearts and well, yeah, we keep trying, we have great we're going to keep persistingly when we're not going to like just curl up like a dead leaf in the in the gutter and blow away. Now, if we're you know, you know the ones that are you know here and fighting. I mean it's just now it just seems like it's a pretty much a constant battle just to stay in the game and and try to function because, yeah, managing it it's already a full time job. Seriously, man like putting on a normal suit every day in the morning to go out into the world and try to pretend like hey, look at this normal suit. Fit's pretty good, Huh, and then at some point the day you like no, doesn't really fit at all. I better go home and hide because I'm about to lose it. Yeah, like, I don't know, I've always, you know, like you get in the group's Attgg and I forget what movie it was, it had to be something into s when I was grow growing up, that they just screamed like in the a mile...

...of the class. And you know I've had, you know, you have that where I've had that weird rd work. You're like on a play and you want to jump out of your damn skin and you just feel like I'm literally gonna Scream and I have no idea what the rest of this group is gonna it's basically got to do here. Yeah, or sometimes you don't even think about the thought that people would even react to what you're about to do, because it's just doesn't even come to mind. That, or just having a conversation. or I'll get excited about something at stand in line at Walmart and all of a sudden I'll talk to the clerk when it's my turn to talk to the clerk and realize I'm about fifty percent louder and twenty percent faster than everybody in that blind hey, how you know it? I'll can see I'm at all all of them like, Oh shit, I'm like God, sometimes I apologize, I'm a sorry. Have Control of my volume there. Yeah, that I mean. And and you manage from great. Great. There is is the speed of which, you know, the brain. Yeah, you know, that was our brains work. It's I mean, it's not a level that sometimes it's like absolutely ridiculous to try to deal with. Yeah, especially after diagnosis, when, like, you know you're doing it, compared to before, where you know you I probably did it how many times and had no idea how I was ramped up in that manner. But yeah, now I just felt offended all the time when I was younger, because I was always full of energy and excited and want to talk and interrupt and never, never, and I didn't think my point it was more important or anything else. I just couldn't contain myself and then I would be shut down and I thought it people were against me, like my personality, when it was really my emotional disorder they were having a problem with. Yes, I made it's you know, I think it's just a lot of the same for definitely for us too. And I actually had or developed a pretty, pretty horrible statter when I was about for and at this point I'm not so sure if it was the bipolar already sneaking out, because I can trace it back to sure when I was ten, eleven, twelve years old. Yeah, like I you know stopped, you know, when I could start to read remember my life, but just a sped up process. And you know I mean for me, it took from four years old to like almost my middle s to be able to, you know, just communicate effectively without you know, which it still rids. It's likely had from time to time. But like the you get stuck on the word the. Yeah, yeah, you say that like six times and you're like how can I not say the seriously? So, yeah, last week I was editing a podcast with Alex Hobby and I caught myself one point just libit, stammering, like like I had like I had stammer, like I had a stammer it disorder and like Whoa am I developing a stammered sort? I'm like, what was that? Nervous? What was going on there? Weird. It's funny you say that, because I you know, like we think about us, yeah, more than anybody else does. And I literally just listened to that show in the last I don't know, a couple of hours and I didn't even notice it. Oh, because I added it out, like it's okay, okay. It was so bad. I like it was like a sentence and a half of me just just stammering and like get it together, man, I just snip, snip, snip. It was gone. Yeah, the benefit of not actually live streaming is, yeah, are we record live, quote unquote live, and I just I just because I don't want us to sound stupid or say anything that's super egregiously false. Just accidentally and occasionally do. So I just cut those parts out. Thank you for that, because I was already planning on saying at least something stupid, offensive or or over the top, which you know, I'm not sure. I have a tendency to overshare, especially pre diagnosis, and usually always gets me in try some point. I can't. Yeah, I still do. I can't not, I don't, and I'm will conscious of it. I'm not actually conscious of at the moment. I'm doing it more like a sneeze, you know, you sneeze, and once you sneeze, do you like, Oh, yeah, just knee and I know that about it. oversharing, like Yep, but just shared way too much, and then I kind of scamper off and be embarrassed about it. Is it? that a horrible feeling, because I know it and and it usually hits me, you know, like the next day it's like it's like you wake up and you're like, Holy Crap, what the hell, what the hell was I saying yesterday? And and why? And then you know and then you like, once again, I try to reconcile...

...that and move on, and then you do it again the next day and you're like, you know, yeah, not at the tape place. You're like maybe I just shouldn't talk at this point. Seriously, and I overshare about the dumb things right, not even I just talked too much. Maybe that's it. Like it work. I digress into things that are not work related on the on the regular, on the raising basis, and they're always super weird, bizarre things. Everyone at work thinks I'm a pretty much a Weirdo, but they like me a lot because I keep them entertained. Well, that should do, or I wouldn't be listening. Yeah, yeah, I'll take it. Am like I I'll just keep paying me and I'll stick around. When you got diagnosed for Real, like officially. Did that help you or hinder you, or has it kind of flip flopped back and forth? I would say it absolutely helped. I finally felt validated for everything that I had thought for I don't know, D have your thirty years that like I have a thinking problem and that you know, that turned into a thinking and drinking thing and and you know, you just do that and hang on until you hope somebody figures it out, and maybe that's where some of the oversharing comes in. It's got you just want somebody to figure it out, like yeah, help, we point the way. Yeah, because you know, I'm not sure how many doctors or or therapist or friends or whichever, to actually get a diagnosis for for you. But you know, I had had saw somebody in my early s and the guy ended with, if you continue to think this way, you're going to kill yourself. Oh yes, and that's the end of our session. And there wasn't like any you know, like here man like just breathe in for three seconds, hold it and breathe out for three and that might help you when you have these, you know, obsessive negative thoughts. You know, he didn't even give me one damn thing to like have a coping skill, like he's one coping skill. He gave me nothing, like GRANDPA advice. It was worse than that, because he's got this big office and all these books and you know he's got a couch there. So you know from the movies. I see you don't like dude. I get in there, like am I supposed to lay it on the couch? was like one of those things. It's like I don't even know what to do, so awkwards, like it's weird. It's like you can go where you want. Well, can I lay on the couch? Sure, I'm like fuck yeah, that's what I'm paying for when lay on that couch. Yeah, that what at that's what I did. I played on the count. I want the experience. Geez, like, you know, like Bob Wilty, and what about Bob there? Yeah, you're just like, I don't know, crazy stuff, man. Yeah, the label thing is really it really trips me out because when I first heard it, you know what I think. Okay, so when I was in my late teens, early s boy, I could drink a lot right, and I never really thought of myself as an alcoholic, but I could out drink alcoholics and I started to worry about it and then I hung out with I went to like an AA meetium once I'm like Nah, this vibe doesn't fit right, like I don't feel or think like these people. And then, you know, several months later whatever, I got diagnosed and I'm like Ah, fuck, that's it. I was just drinking the tamper down that mania and when I knew that that was it, I stopped drinking. I wasn't even an issue. I didn't even have a problem stop drinking. I'm like, Oh, is this a feeling? Oh, Yep, I want to drink because I'm hyper, because that's that Goddamn mania, and that's when I just stopped, like nope'll find something else. So yeah, in that sense having a label did help me there, but later on in life I started waving the flag around like I have Bible or whoo and am no, that wasn't too cool. That's like, to your point, over sharing or just telling too many people are being proud of something that maybe I shouldn't be so proud of. I'm not ashamed of it. I can't really control it, but I'm not sure I be so proud of having bipolar disorder sometimes. Yeah, that's one of those, you know. I just it's just not very accepted, and by very I mean it's just not accepted at all, almost whatsoever. Oh my God. You know, as far as what she said about the drinking, I did the same damn thing. It literally like once I got diagnosed, I went from drinking every day and I don't think it matters how much. If you drink every day, you probably have a problem. Maybe. Yeah. Yeah, let's say if you drink over six beers a day, you probably have a problem. Maybe right. Well, in our case, yeah, we got we were drinking more than I would normal person would drink, for sure, but I wasn't like me. I don't feel like a alcoholic. Yeah, but apparently we were just trying to he's...

...wash, he's that pain, he's that speed squash, the hypo mania. And seriously, you know, I mean I don't know how I did it for thirty years. HMM. Yeah, well, well, I guess. Fortunately we were young and bodies heal fast, you know, so we lived through it and figured it out in time. But can you imagine all the people never quite figure out, they never go to a strength to figure out if they have any kind of disorder and just drink themselves into death by the time they're our age? Yeah, I mean, I'm ANA lie there. There's absolutely times where, sure, I was over the limit of what they would call. You're still alive, she's right, you know, you're still breathing. Ah, and I don't know what you want to call it. Guardian Angels, Higher Power, yeah, whatever, Yep, bact is, it's I'm still here and you know, you know, I got up, got a story that you know, at some point needed to needed to get out, and you know you were you were my first. I think of it like this sometimes, because I because like you, I'm I don't know. Do you move a lot? I move a lot, and one of the fund of things I like to do is when I move in the south. When I was in Louisiana, was crossover to the wrong side of the tracks, as they called it, the locals called it. Well, apparently just where the black people live. But I went to Black Church and when you go to Black Church there's they're always like, is anybody want to speak to? Have any new visitors? And I always think of guests I have on this show, especially if they've never spoken about their bipolar disorder, as like those guys that, like me, like stand up in church and like Oh, brother John, welcome brother John, like finally, like not not coming out in this sense, leg hey, I'm just I'm I found out I'm gay, nothing like that. Or I found out I'm religious. None of those. But it kind of has a similar vibe with people with bipolar disorder finally claiming their voice and speaking out publicly. It's like fuck yeah, I acknowledge it, I have it and I'm still a normal person right, or at least I think I'm a normal person. I'm not sure what the rest world thinks, but at this point, like a man. You know. Well, yeah, we could do normal stuff, right, you do normal stuff. Yeah, so like what? Yeah, like, you go, you get up and go to work, you take care of your kids, you got you know, I'm sure you do stuff on the weekend like normal person at probably have a hobby or two. And I'm like, well, that's what else do people expect of us? Like we're not only doing normal stuff that they do, but we're doing it under the, you know, the dark cloud of a mental disorder that's omnipresent. It's always there, it's always fucking with our thoughts, telling us where horrible, miserable people, telling us we saw. I mean there's so many like negative thoughts to go on, and I'm ruminating mind and to be able to still function under all that dress, I don't know. I'm not saying we need a fucking award for it or something, but Jesus like back off a little bit people. You know, it would be nice if the reservoirs for it, because we would be like at the top of the foodchain there. It feels like sometimes in social media it's a contest with the the quote unquote social media, what you call them, like mental health advocates or activist. Some of them seem to frame themselves like their mental disorders more important or more valid than others, and I'm like, yeah, I don't think so, though. I think we're all fucked just the same, because it's all a matter of perspective. Right, absolutely, and I mean if you have it and the diagnosis is, you know, hundred percent on, you got to fight the same shit that we do. Yeah, yeah, and if you want to, you know, kind of jump on a high horse and think your problem. Sure, you know, are more important than you know, than the rest of US folks. Yeah, it's not a way to solve the problems, that's for sure. Maybe you're not helping us much at that point. Maybe note of what what, Hey, did you when you got diagnosed? Did they start you off on medication? Yes, so that, I mean, that was huge. And Man, there's a there's always there's a whole lot of very odd, crazy behavior that like came that k before diagnosis finally got here. Like what, what did you do? What some of the crazier things you've done before you got diagnosed? Oh Man, let's see that. I'm trying to like spend this and like a fair sense to like all that, all the parties that were involved in this. Of course, of course, and chaos, he said, just not like friends are families. Don't listen to friends or families podcast. So the only people who are going to hear this other Weirdos like us who found a weird podcast. So it's a it's...

...all good, you don't have to like, you know, just don't name names, all right. So let's just say so, I'm going to put it this way once again. I sought out a therapist, you know, telling her that hey, look, there is there is something wrong wrong with my braid, and this is a therapist that I spoke to like ten years earlier. You know, wow, okay, went to the church, which I stopped going to church along a long time ago. Raised Catholic, an artiboy and all that crazy stuff. So, you know, once I left home, I never, you know, I never went back, which I just feel not bad about at all. What the Catholic guilt? Yes, it's Commons gone this. I did the same thing with the Baptist it. I mean, I have no offense. I'll still go back to church, like on the holidays with my parents, because, you know, that's what you do, but it's just not my cup right now, mind either. So so get through a couple sessions with her and she's just like adamant. She's like look, if you think you're crazy, you're not. You know you, you know you're raising your son, you know your work and in a family business, this that, and you know, I'm sure she she's had all all great intentions and so, you know, I kind of, you know, did did my two to three weeks of therapy there and I was, you know, absolutely, there's there's no issues going on here. So like a week later I end up, that's a reconnecting with somebody from a pretty long time ago and kept in touch throughout let's say twenty and twenty years or so. Wow, like a high school friend or just a friend from work through those times or something. Yeah, well, it it was let's say somebody I may dated for like a very okay, now, that's nice that you're able to like maintain relationships with an X. that's cool. That's hard to do. I mean I think she may. I think she was the only one. So not a surprise. Yeah, you know, that contact was still there. So and up going from one part of the state to another part where she lived about seven hour, five to seven hour drive. Well, okay, cool, that's quite a move. Just yeah, well, to date somebody. Yeah, that that's far away, or to reconnect, or whatever you want to call it. Yeah, so that happened for like a month and then ended off, run it off to Vegas and and, you know, getting getting hitch. Yeah, right, who? And and you know, I'm sure there was, you know, lots of eyebrows and heads heads turning as as people probably got news or what did this going? This is this, this may not end well. And and it did not end well. You know, there there wasn't domestic violence or anything like that. I was just just, you know, there there was money there and then there was no longer money there, and that's stressful. Yeah, yeah, and then there was, you know, there was some other family members involved. And so, anyway, within a couple months, you know, there there was you know, a lot of a lot of money burned through, a lot of unnecessary thing. Yeah, just living a wildlife for a while. Not Illegal, not like you know, bunny and Clyde or anything, but just like probably both of your families are going like what the hell are these people doing. What are they? Yeah, and that if they would have had any idea that. Like you're eating at a restaurant, I like the airport and tipping hundred dollar bills and it's just like, I don't care if you're worth whatever. Say you're worth five million. Are you leaving hundred dollar bills at Oh yeah, me, for sure, I have, because I'm bipolar. I just yeah, give all the money away, it's going stale. Get rid of that Shit. More will come. Don't worry. It's absolutely you know, I think that's one of the things that maybe, quote, normal people have maybe the hardest time, or at least my family and some folks that know just the hardest time, trying to wrap their heads around like how did you piss all your money away? How did you match your credit cards out two days? Yeah, and it's like like, you don't it's like they've never even tried. It's pretty easy. It's really easy to Piss away a lot of money in a very short amount of time. See, and I've done it on several occasions. So you know, it's not like you get am you know, it's not like you get a diagnosis and you're like, Oh, I got this all, figure it out right, because there's no handbook like Oh, okay, you have bipolar disorder. By here's the handbook and you note the first thing don't...

...spend any money ever again. Because, man, the moment you start space like Oh, that feels good. Yeah, it's nice, spend that money. Get rid of it. Yeah, it's those you know, those dopea mean hits that's like yeah, yeah, feel good, feel, feel great, feel wonderful bed, and then one day you like wake up and and it's like, I don't know whatever feel like to really like hurt somebody. And you know when some odd sense car accident or something, because said, I don't think I would do well on the afterbath of that. But you know, you wake up in this like catastrophic event just happened and and you don't even like you can't figure out how the hell that happened and how you're going to stop it the next time. Yeah, yeah, whatever. When my kids were younger, I don't I doubt they remember this. They don't really remember any good things from when they were younger that I've told them. They remember all the bad things. But when they were younger I used to try to explain by polar disorder like an allergy, like it like a sneeze, and that you know you can't. You can't. You don't know when you're about to sneeze, it just happens and then you know after you sneeze that you sneezed, and if you sneezed on somebody, you would certainly know that you sneezed on somebody and you would apologize. And but you can't help that you have allergies. And that's kind of how I have explained by polar disorder to people that just don't understand the mental like the rapid onset of it and the fact that the moment that it's happening we don't were. It's not like we're out of control. It just like there's nothing to control. We're just thinking way differently at that moment, because when people think out of control they imagine like a madman bouncing around a rubber room. It's not like that. We're still standing still, but our thought process is lost control for a second. Absolutely and you know, I happen to catch a period of just straight media, you know, which for three months. I mean that might have been the threat. First three months in my entire life that I didn't feel crazy, you know, like like there was, there is nothing wrong in my world, like everything was good, like, you know, all the Times that I, you know, knew there was something wrong in my with, you know, with the way I thought, all that was gone. It just completely wiped out and everything just made sense and it was like almost like you just broke on through and got to the other side. You know. It was kind of a worse egg, you know, and you're so clear now. Yeah, I think. You know, I mentioned that to like one person and I'm like Hey, bad, I'm made it to the other side. And and then even in a man it, you know, even in a manic episode, like after I said that, and it was a close friend. So was it a huge deal. But even after I said I was like, Damn, that's that's pretty jacked up to say to somebody when you're like in your late S, you know. Yeah, you know, you found your way to like happiness and and all this, you know, all that grandacity, that kind of will. Yeah, I found it, but that'st off. Yeah, it's like, you know, it's like playing golf, and I don't know if you're a golf or not, but it's like, you know you're a crappy Golfer, but every crappy Golfer probably has that one day where they shoot like ten shots, fifteen shots better than they ever had and then they play again and the balls going left, right. Oh, you know, that's a SOT side way. Yeah, you play so good a couple times and then it screws up your handicap and then you go back to playing crappy again. You know, you know, you go from puring it to top chopped for putting for guys. Yeah, yeah, I don't know about that. The whole labeling thing. So after you were diagnosed and you started taking men's what they give you first, like Sarah Weel, to settle yours down. Yeah, that's what they give a lot of bipolar people. So if you're new to bipolar and you're listening to this show, that's super normal because basically they just want you to sleep, to get back on a sleeping cycle. That's normal. And Sarah Quell, my first doctor, said, Oh yeah, that's basically run off sort a stranquilizer, and I'm like Holy Shit, because it feels like it, especially if you're just been wired out and stressed and man, the first couple of days are not even the first week. As I will I'm tired as Shit, man, I'm tired, and you just sleep a lot and finally adjust it so that you can get up and go do your life and go to work and all that. But yeah, what else did they give you after that? I could took mostly Lamichtel after that. Yeah, now we're kendred spirits here, John. I. I got, I actually got love, Love, love michnel first, and there's the stutter raising. It's ugly. Had and then Sarah Quell within like a couple days past that. So I don't know what they've figured out. And those like three days. But yeah, I was all both at those to start and yeah, still still on those and and that's all. Thank goodness, that that I've had to take the manage just the best as possible. Yeah, that seems like reasonable medicine. I'm not, I mean I'm not a scientist. I don't really...

...know what reasonable medicine is, but it always tripped me out a little bit with the the salts, what the fuck? The lithium right, because that requires way more attention, and just all the things that bipolar person can't really do that well. Plus I have adhd. I just can't sort my meds. I take him at the wrong time. I'd take too much. I'm like just take more this time. So I couldn't imagine. They said, Oh yeah, with lithium, got to come to the hospital like every month, month or six weeks or something like. There's no fucking way, are you kidding me? and No, I could barely get to the hospital every six months and they want me to come every six weeks. So I always avoided the lithium. What else that? I have a big list of meds because first that they weren't sure and they then wanted to treat my depression, but they couldn't really give me anything that would activate my mania. So, yeah, it's always just the minimal stuff. And the thing with the bipolar meds to that kind of sucked, was that there will have work overnight, like aspirin on a headache, you just got to keep taking them an eventually, Huh. Yeah, yeah, I guess I feel better. Yeah, you know, it takes a while and I think just the initial you know, you know, I don't know if it's shock or what it is for folks that happen. But you know, you get you know, you finally get a diagnosis and you know I made it. I mean it blew me out because I was looking and, you know, playing doctor on Webmd and punching end symptoms and thinks of that nature for, you know, for quite a while before I started to figure out, like this is like this is one of three things. Yeah, what were the other two that you thought it might be? I thought it could be borderline personality, which, you know, there's there's some overlapping there. So I don't think I was completely wrong. Oh yeah, I think I have that somewhat. I just don't tell anybody because even doctors stigmatize that yet. So I just thought that's I've even worst than bibolar. If you tell yeah, if you walk around and tell somebody you've your your borderline personality, like like yeah, that's what I have. You know, you might as well have an axe in one hand and like a gun and the other when you tell them yeah, because Steven is the claric, because they're running not heard. Doctors and nurses talk shit about borderline people behind the scenes, you know, on the other side of the curtain. When I was there for an x ray and stuff like that. So and I know plenty of people with it and I probably have some aspects of it as well. That's why I'm like, well, I'm just not going with that one. I already found out what happened. When people say you got bipolar disorder, it's not like saying you got depression or anxiety. That's cool, that's almost trendy nowadays. But once you leak over into bipolar disorder and psychosis and things like that, people start taking a step back when you talk with them. Absolutely, and you know, I play some some other podcasts there here here their jawd and and some of the specialist with like, you know, the borderline, because I've listened to a few of those just because one I can out. There's enough crossed over there. Yep, but that. But they're like doctors don't want to deal with borderline whatsoever. It's just those people are so difficult to deal with. Yeah, and you know that's that's really shitty to say, because well, it is. And I think to your point, I think a lot of it is because doctors want to treat things that that you can you can either cut out or give a pill for and with borderline. That's not a doctor's job. Borderline people just really need lots and lots of therapy to unwind all that toxic shit that was dumped into their brain when they were young. But yeah, and who can afford hours and hours of therapy for years on end? That's that's the really critical thing. So I think maybe that's why doctors, because it's not as simple. With the as the myth that bipolar disorders a chemical and balance what people like to say. Doctors, I think, buy into that as well and think, well, this pill will, whatever they think, balance the chemicals back is. They still see it as a pill treatable thing, whereas not borderline. And borderline also falls into a personality disorder with narcissism, narcissistic personality disorder and other things like that, which nobody likes to deal with either. Right. I mean I made you start to throw in a small group of things with like some of the tough ones on top, because I don't think that you can. Personally, I don't think you could have bipolar, you know, borderline schizophrenia. I don't think you can have those without having other things. Right. Yeah, where it's addiction, alcohol, drugs, Booze, women, you know? Oh Yeah, Dixon's, let's talk about that. I like women. You mentioned you. I know you. Do you mention like gambling? Well, is that a thing? Yeah,...

...am I putting too much emphasis on that? Like it sounds like you probably don't have a problem with it before. I've never had a really problem with gambling per se in a casino. I gambled other things in my life. But tell me about the gambling thing and how did you get into it and out of it? You know, it's started early. You know I was at it. I'd go to dog tracks when I was young, you know what the family member so, or horse tracks, and you know I was already gambling my you know, gabling some work money when I was I don't know, thirteen, fourteen, but the fun should like the past time words you really like need the money. I got to get ahead or like, what was that I driver heard? I I didn't ever think about it, like I need the money like I need to buy two pair of shoes. Yeah, okay, the rat it was always something that like it took the I don't know, like reading, reading a racing form, whether it be horses, dogs, Yep, whatever, that like soothed my brain. Okay, that I was out of my head. Got It. You know that that that works for a long time, especially if you don't get killed like you know, you don't write right, you know, you don't blow your whole bank roll in one day, which you know, being being bipolar, having it once again, whatever. It's amazing that I didn't back that, because how could you not, you know, Piss it all away in one day there and then do it another aspects of life. So isn't that the thing, right? Like they say you shouldn't be emotional about gambling, and that's all we are, is emotional. I mean it's you know, there's certain things. You know, Gambling Wise, I've had had really good success, like over the course of my life, and it's it's playing craps, and I've pretty good with, you know, spotting up a couple horses here and there. That that's own not you know, not winning a ton of money, and I'm also not losing a tonny money. Yeah, there's some kind of luck. You don't like a hobby that kind of pays for itself. You might cost you a little money, but you know, as hobbies do. Yeah, I mean if you come around even you know, that's you know, that's a lot of days that, you know, out of my head. Don't have the negative of Sesse of thoughts and you know those are yeah, I think that's reasonable. I didn't want to put too much emphasis on that if it wasn't actually a problems. kind of sounds like as much as of an expense as maybe golfing would be. You know, it just the thing you do. Yeah, I mean I haven't done it like recently. You know, I'll look at the Kentucky Derby or something and for the few times, you know, once every couple years, actually get to you know, a lot of perhaps table. It's amazing the discipline I have at that game and have no other discipline and any other aspective like the rest of my life that I do there. I mean, it makes it really makes no sense. But maybe because it's like there's a statistical yeah, you found the rule or you know the rules and you're like why would anybody play other than the rules? Right, you know, or you know I've developed a couple systems and yeah, right, that's what I mean. Or guarantee to make you money. But it's like, I know, I played this way and it's really the only way I play. But yeah, I mean if I can, you know, spend three thousand dollars on Amazon or at a bar or something like that, it makes no sense that I've been disciplined and you know, when that walk of life there. So yeah, well, one of those things that I have. You know that I've no idea of how that happens. But yeah, there's the have been through things in my life. I look back I'm like that was a weird phase. But yeah, it's not like it was an activity that I can just do now. But I just don't do it. But I look back I'm like, well, I sure did that. A lot of wonder why I'm super into that thing. Yeah, that's what we grow up you know, distractions of the brain, and I got I got married younger and as a brain distraction get out. I mean yeah, I've moved. I've moved states to distract my brain when it's in a like a horrible couple month just downward beaten spell. You know, I've done huge things to just calm at you know, yes, the noise in there. Yeah, there's so much activity going on your head sometimes you need something really extreme to like take you away. Like fortunately, like you said, Golf. That golf is a good one as we get older, those kind of activities. I played the drum. So you just little things that you could just do that your brain kind of goes on autopilot and gives you a rest. Yeah, I mean, that's I mean, I've built a couple little putting green. Oh No, way,...

...put Greens and yeah, and done some waterfalls and you know, that stuff just absolutely at never feels like work out of my head all day. What if? Yeah, what a fun project, a plus. You get to your it's athletic like he gets your you're moving out, you're not thinking about any of life's problems. You get your hands in the dirt, moving the grass. Nice. Yeah, there's I mean it's way better than the than the Gig gap got going right now. Not that there's anything wrong with that one, but you know, you know, I feel like I need a freaking assistant, yeah, like to like deal with the other parts of business that my brain just doesn't want to deal with straight up, like bureaucracy, red tape, all that stuff, filling out forms, read an instructions, anything that. Yeah, yeah, that's apparently I didn't. I thought I was just being an ass and my doctor said no, that's all adhd stuff. You can't that's why it's driving you crazy. I'm like Oh, thanks, thanks for the new label. Then I just tell yeah, sorry, boss, I can't read those instructions. Just tell me the long and short of it. I mean, I got diagnosed with OCD younger and then adhd after the bipolar and yeah, so I feel you bad. It's just a lot of the same stuff, right. Well, I keep telling them. I'm like maybe it's just hyper and depressed, maybe it's not mania, and I can't get a straight answer on that one. And they're like well, whatever you want. Like well, what do you mean whatever I want? Like doesn't the MED's make a difference, is the wit. They're like well, yeah, but how you feel? Oh my God, I feel fine. Whatever. I like like like what do you saw doctors along the way? Did because it seems like you're the type of guy that would present well, you know, like to wear and dude too. Well, because I guess, and I don't go to the doctor when I'm bad, like I just flake on the pointment. I just don't. Absolutely do not go, and the when nobody sees me for weeks. When I finally got can get dressed and go to the doctor, I'm like, Dupe Dude, Hey, I'm John here. I'm feeling bad. Some of the time they're like one time my doctor had little Russian lady doctor and Hollywood California, like the Hollywood mental health clinic. She is looking at my charts at the end of our like six weeks a sessions and I go hmm, so what do you think I have? She just goes, HMM, well, I don't know what you have, but you definitely have something like Devy Lady, that's messed up. As you were saying that, the thought my head that she was gonna say was whatever's wrong with you? Was No small thing, John. Right. They're like all right, all right, I love that. And then I went back for another since eight weeks with the different DBT COUNSELOR WHO's Super Hot, and I like, how dare you give you a super sexy counselor? This is just mean. Dvt Is an interesting thing, right. Yeah, you know, it's it seems to cut out like a lot of the therapy work. It's basically a big fuck you. It's like yeah, what do you think about that? Like we mean what I think about that? How does it make you feel? Like bad? That's why I'm here. Why? Good Enough? It's just it's like looking in a mirror. I had a my earlier doctor was like that. When you were talking about the doctor who sat around with his his pipe and the big, big leather couch, I had a doctor. He just sat back in the same kind of vibe and he's a HMM. He hardly said any words. I'm tell I'd talk like I talked now, just forever, and then he would be huh, I see, tell me more, and then maybe at the end of the hour it's like, okay, well, how does that make you feel like? Oh, for fuck's sake, this is all the stuff I used to watch on the TV. I'm like this why I don't go to psychiatrist or or therapist is because there's they stupid like that, and obviously I don't think they're stupid. I still go to them, but when I was a kid that's what I thought, because they act exactly like the stereotype cliche I see on TV. They don't do much help. They didn't. Then, finally, after shopping around over years, and years and years, you do find some that unlocked, some keys to some shit and like Huh, and you'll never forget some of those keys that they give you. So that's worth going to therapy by itself. Right. And and I think the big thing that you just said there is finding the right person, the right therapist, the right psychiatrist, you know it. It's amazing it takes so long to get diagnosed with, you know, with whatever, bi polar, even borderline and all the rest of them. Yeah, like, like, how does it take that many doctors, that many therapists, cheese right, oh, over thirty years or even three years or five years. You know, you hear all these stories. It took me fifteen or, you know, to twelve years or twenty years. And and that's like, I mean I'm...

...not surprised by it at like at all, but I like, what the Hell is wrong with them, with the Medical Cup? Yeah, especially the therapists and the psychiatrist who just missed it. Like how do you miss this stuff? Or how do you not follow up with like I think you have a problem. You're telling me you have a problem. Let's get you here at end. Let's you know, yeah, let let's let you help figure some of this out too, because you know, you're the one that has, or I'm the one that has, all these issues and they can't just, you know, figure that all out. And you know what, fifteen minute now and they're only going to fix, fix the ones that you give them. So when you go to a therapist or or psych doctor, whatever, say you go to a psych doctor, the ones who prescribe meds, and basically you just harp on the fact that you know, I can't stop crying, I can't stop crying, or whatever. He's going to give you a pill so you stop crying. Or if you say, Oh, my elbow hurts, my he's going to give you pill so your elbow hurts. He can't fix all of our mental health problems with one pill, so they just typically will give you a pill to figure out how to resolve the most the highest priority problem you have. And I don't I think a lot of people going with maybe unrealistic expectations of what a psych doctor, what those pills were, actually do to help. I'm not antipill by any means. A lot of pills definitely help and we'll get you to the next stage, but band. They're not magic. Right, absolutely not. And you know I mean I look back to something because I'm very persistent and not sure where that comes from and definitely gets me in trouble from time to time. But you know, I'm you know, at times I was telling that, I was telling to talk the doctor what I think I needed, and they're prescribing it. Like yeah, like who doesn't? Like I'm not the expert, like they have to know that. So, no matter what's saying, like no matter what I'm saying or the crap coming out of my mouth, like shouldn't you take that with like crates of salt instead of throwing major depression onto my resume and given me, you know, pro Zak or letter bro Yeah, some new she's so loft. Trials. Yeah, I awa tried like five of those and they all work for crap. And you know, come to find out later, after died to know sis, that you know, those type of pills make what I have even worse. Right, right then, I don't think can't be that inexperience there. Maybe they are, I just don't I don't get it. Here's one of the big problems I see about, especially medical care in America is the continuity of care for people like us who end up having to move because of our life, you know. Well, then we have to sign it for new medical at the new job, or we're poor and we have to sign up for government medical care or whatever. You know, all those things come. All that shit is in one commonplace so that the little lady in the Hollywood medical fucking mental health hospital, all her notes should be there now in Louisiana, when I was there, or here in Oklahoma, or when I'm back in California, whatever. It should all be in one place. And if they're reinventing the wheel and waiting for a crazy person to tell them what's wrong with us so we can get the pill of the day, that's not going to work. Yeah, like not at all, and it will doesn't wear. I mean I obviously there's only, like, you know, twenty different types of pills they can give us now. So if you go through enough of them, one might actually have some good results. So it just seems like we're just playing a game, though, instead of really trying to get it done. Just start throwing, man. I mean, what do you think about how long it takes to get all right combination of medicine. That that right, that works. Yep, you know, it's first, first, the right diagnosis and then the right medicines. It's so many combinations right there, and those two things, oh my goodness, like it's it's just so much, you know, to get those two to even line up the minus therapy, you know, on top of it, right, just getting a diagnosis and some pills that are going to work for you, and that's if the system work perfectly. That's not including, oh, that phone numbers disconnected. Oh, leave a message of voicemailboxes full. We can schedule you in seven months. There's so many little fuckeries that happen in the system on top of that, I don't even understand how we've made it this far, and I guess that's one of the messages that we should let people know. If you're new to being sick, to having a mental illness, it is a lot of work. It is so much work and it's so unfair. I don't even know, man, it is so unfair and what there's no other choice but to have to do it. And you could complain on twitter about it. You can, you know, whine about it. You could try to get you know, unemployment or disability benefits and just live that life. But whatever, it's still...

...all of that stuff. Even trying to get disability. That's a lot of work. Trying to try and hold down a job, that's more work than it should be. All the stuff is so much extra work and I have a lot of empathy for people like well, you and the rest of my guests who try to get it done. So tell me this last thing I was looking at here. You tell me about public speaking and elementary education. Ah, so, I let's just start with I had blown out a disc in my back and my late S. okay, so I had I've got my two year degree when I was like twenty one, working full time and just grabbing credits and stuff and and got an associate stand and then blew the back out and I was like, I'm a laborer, man, I'm a puzzler outside and and you know this. This is not good. I have to I have to come up with something else. So went back and always I'm not sure like how this works, but I've always dealt with children or you know, young you know young kids and young adults so much better than actual adults. You know that. Yeah, there was at least a connection there that I felt good about, that I felt that I could do do, do well in and be able to effect lives in a positive way. So I went back to get, you know, the second part of a four year degree and got that in elementary education and and along the way there took, you know, a couple public speaking classes and pretty much the elementary education program you know, as a public speaking class. So for like two years. That actually took me longer than that because in between a back surgery or two. Yes, stop for stop for four years and then went back past that. So yeah, I was able to, you know, really function out of ridiculous high level, you know, when I went back to school. Yeah, so one of those things where I look back now I like, how'd I do it? Did you got it taken care of if you took care of business. So you got a degree in elementary education. Is that mean you could be a teacher or substitute teacher or and then work your way up to run a school? As a principle? I don't know how the hierarchy of a school works, but I don't think there's any chance in hell that I would make it to be in a principle. But yes, I could absolutely substitute and get a teaching job. And you know, it's just another one of those things that, you know, my back finally started getting a little better like twenty years later, right. Yeah, like in my late forty is around the diagnosis. I'm not sure if there's any you know. Yeah, I think so. I'll tell of my back. I kind of goes along with that. Yeah, Yep, yeah, so that's really cool. I work with kids. For five years I worked in it was like a dog pound for kids. It was like a juvenile hall, but the kids were not criminals. They're just had no parents or the parents were criminals. But those kids lived in there with school in there everything. So, yeah, I worked there for five years. I love that. And then when I finally had my own baby with my wife, like, Oh my God, this is so much easier than than raising all those other fifty crazy kids. This is just one little, simple, little baby. Yeah, I love working with kids. Still Do. That's why I was like, I'm jealous. I want to be elementary teacher, specially now when there's so much crazy parents because of the political environment, given teachers a hard time. We just love to just dig in there and just teach kids stuff, like probably subversive stuff. I'd probably be fired a lot for teaching stuff the parents didn't want them and necessarily know about the way the world works. Nothing, nothing Grosser, you know, on Tooward, just, you know, things about the bigger picture stuff. Now I think I was a rounded enuff. Teachers do it like and get you know, like your you know, you're you're you know you're in class. Why is why is the word slipping? Slip it through by bye here. You know, you know you're watching the teachers and what they do. So you know when you're here and some of the stuff that comes out out of their mouths and you're like, holy crap, I didn't you could get away with that right, like like, like what the hell are they say? Like this is science in there. You know. You're like that's not talking about talking about something on Youtube and I like, Y, not science related at all. Oh yeah, it's like there's a little bit of leeway here to be a goofball. Yeah, yeah, it's funny. I went to end up going to a continuation high school back in, you know, those days, and I didn't learn until later that all of the teachers at my continuations high school had also...

...been kicked out of their high schools for different reasons, and we're sentenced to work at the continuation high school with US jackasses. I'm like, that is fantastic. Love it. Well, now I'd rather have a therapist that has bipolar then, you know. So I'd rather get taught by people that, you know, yeah, are like us. I think of that. That's that's the way a lot of folks, you know, in any class of society, is like. You kind of like to hear from people that have similar experiences. Sure, I mean fool guys hang out. Hey will pool guys, and right there's with doctors and bipolars, with bipolars. Eventually someone's got to hang out with us. We hang out with each other. Made you gotta Find Your tribe and and and you know, I haven't completely done that yet. So it's kind of starting with, you know, with you here and and yeah, now that's awesome. I'm glad you had your people. Yeah, I'm glad you stepping out, dude, and if you didn't tell me about your stutter, I would not have noticed it at all. So I think I may have stuttern more than you and I don't have a stutter. So there's that. I probably won't even add this part in the in the podcast because I didn't even notice it. And there's that little so yeah, kind of like I caught somebody very, very late, you know, and in my s and and I don't even like it wasn't even somebody I knew and she had heard me. You know, I don't know whether I was talking. I have no idea like where this happened. I just remember that that it did. And she was like, you know, if you start to roll your words like it's a continuous wave, yeah, she's like it'll really help you and maybe at some point you just kind of, you know, have this I don't know if it's better energy or you know, your vibe just kind of changes a bit when you can start to just roll your words and life got easier, at least on the speech side of things. Yeah, so I don't know if you can hear it, and kind of the way I talked, and you know when when you have hypo mate Maydia had really flies. But yeah, just the kind of rolling wave thing and just keep things going and and you know, at that point, yeah, you hang on and hope for the best. Yeah, that's for sure. I typically have been a drummer for most of my life, since I was as old as I can remember, and I typically think of things since in terms of rhythm. Like when I watch a comic or comedian, I tend to like, Oh yeah, this guy's got good rhythm. It's not necessarily the joke or the content of the words they're saying, it's the rhythm, and I think that helps me speak to because I even if I don't know the all the words that are about to come out of my mouth, I know the beat. I'm trying to end on how you might have to cut this part out because I just lost my train of thought, but I do that all the time. I'm surprised it took this long because I know what's common and I just you know, it's one of those things like predict a Hypo mania episode. You're like, well, shit, I can't do that, but I know it's common. Yeah Right. It's like I know this stuff is come in my way, just like the tide, you know, it's like the waves. They'll be here, just be patient. So it's like the waves are never stopping, man, no, it's it's just no matter how long you can ride the nice one. Yeah, it's right. This is not the choppy stuff that you got to take what you get, man. Right, that's funny. I would I would ask you if you had anything to promote, but you don't. You're here anonymously, so that that's cool. But is there anything you'd like to say to the world? Just Spread Peace and good tidings? I don't know, man. What's how do you want to close up? Sure, I had guy was buying my artificial tour for when I did a couple jobs and he was just all about bgt. Why? Be Good to yourself and that takes care of a lot of other water up a lot of other issues in life, and I just always remember that. And he was great guy, talking to me a whole bunch and got me through the process when I first started. And Yeah, if you've made it here and you're here in this and you've got my polar or whatever, yeah, just hanging there, man, and be good to yourself and just keep on plugging man. It's tough, but that's the one. That's a good way to leave it. Man. Be Good to yourself. You are one of us you might be alone right now. You know, people say right, you're not alone, and like, I'm fucking alone right now. I'm sitting in a room alone. Your gas lighting me. So I guess you're loan, but you're not the only one, like there's a lot of us alone right now in our own rooms individually, and so I appreciate you coming out of the woodwork and having the balls to get up here in the courage, I should say, to to speak and, if anyone else is listening, want to just talk and kind of break through that wall, break on through to the other side and start public speaking or just find your voice and see what it sounds like to talk on a...

...podcast. It's not a big deal. Just make me, just me right. So I really appreciate you coming on Jay. Thanks for all that, John, you're great man. It's for anybody else, like you said that maybe on the fence about coming on your show. If you live it to a show, you already know he's smooth and easy and it was just that. And, as it sounds right, like I am just like I sound I am. I always thought that that was like try to be like the person you actually sound like. Don't. They'll put on a stick. Just be that at and like you. I mean you must do it and your life and and handle things the same way, because if you listen to the show, sit here and talking with you is almost like listening to the show. It's just kind of a natural process and easy. So it's Neat Huh's like interactive. It's interactive podcast. You go from listening, listening, listening to talking. Now you get to go back and hear this episode in a couple days like yeah, that's my ass. What up, they're talking. How cool is that? Yeah, and one of the cool things is as if you listen to this show and you even if you just listen to a handful of episodes, when I start started, you already come across and I already feel like I know you from just listening a few times and happened, listen to your I don't know, hundred and twenty seven and you are that guy. And this is a smooth and easy process and it was fun. Man. I appreciate it. And now back to the wall.

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